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Matthew 16:19 -- Binding on earth
 Joined: 7/3/2007(UTC)
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Hello All,
Does anyone have a proper translation of the following verse? Still uncertain what this really means.
Mat 16:19: "And I will give to you the keys of the kingdom of the heavens, and whatever you bind on the earth will have been bound in the heavens; and whatever you loose on the earth will have been loosed in the heavens." |
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom. |
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 Joined: 7/4/2007(UTC) Posts: 1,470  Location: England Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
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From www.thewaytoyahweh.com http://www.thewaytoyahuweh.com/...er1/ntmatt.htm#chapter16Swalchy Translation wrote:I shall give and grant, supply and furnish, bestow, permit and appoint to you the keys of the royal power and kingship, authority and kingdom, rule and dominion of heaven, and whatever is bound, tied and chained up, restricting from standing upright upon the earth and land shall prevail and exist as being bound, tied and chained up and restricted from standing upright in Heaven, and whatever is loosened, dismissed, released and set free upon the earth and land shall prevail and exist as being is loosened, dismissed, released and set free in the heavens, the abode of the Supreme One." :) Edited by user Thursday, January 31, 2008 12:33:48 AM(UTC)
| Reason: Not specified |
Signature Updated! Woo that was old... |
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 Joined: 6/28/2007(UTC)
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I have been trying to run this down. Apparently, Matthew 16:19 is also associated with John 20:21-13. Here is what I could find from the Histemi: Standing Upright chapter: Quote:Moving on, the next verse is easily misunderstood. That's partly because it's so poorly translated. Those who crafted the King James Version were evidently attempting to give men the ability to forgive sin, something priests have capitalized upon: "Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained." Dated and unintelligible English aside, men have not been given this authority. The remission of sin is Yahuweh's prerogative.
The New American Standard Bible renders the verse: "If you forgive the sins of any, (their sins) have been forgiven them; if you retain the (sins) of any, they have been retained." The italicized words were added without textual basis in both versions to make the sentence read like the translators wanted it to. There is no basis for the added words in the Greek manuscripts.
Before I attempt to render Yahushua's declaration in contemporary English, I want you to be aware of the fact that all verse and chapter designations are manmade. The subject of this sentence remains the same as the last sentence, the "hagios Spirit." The disciples where now functioning as the Spirit's tabernacle.
Therefore, in context we find: "And when He had said this, He breathed on them and said: 'Accept, associate with, and use (lambano - take upon yourself in order to be carried away, take hold of and use productively, choose to form a relationship with, accept, receive, experience, and exploit courageously) the revered, cleansing, and set-apart Spirit. If (an) someone (tis - a certain individual) is dismissed and sent away (aphiemi - divorced, forsaken, or disregard; neglected or omitted) [by the Spirit], missing the way and erring (hamartia - being without a share because they wandered off on the wrong path and were not made upright), he or she (autos) will be dismissed and sent away (aphiemi - divorced, forsaken, and disregard; neglected and omitted). If (an) someone (tis - a certain individual) is empowered to gain possession (krateo - if they hold on to and retain) [the hagios Spirit] they will empowered to gain possession and they will be held on to and be retained (krateo) [by the Spirit]." (John 20:22-23)
What God is saying is that those who err and miss the way in this life, and those who are as a result dismissed by the Spirit, will be forsaken in heaven. And those who are reborn into Yahuweh's family by way of the Spirit shall always be empowered and shall always be retained. Adoption is forever because our Spiritual Mother is eternal. Does anyone have any additional insights (especially regarding Matthew 16:19) or references from YY? |
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 Joined: 9/10/2007(UTC)
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Location: Washington State
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In the Palaeo Name Version translatation of MattitYahu by Todd Effren (translated from the 'du Tillet Hebrew'), Mt. 16:19 reads: "And to you I will give a key of Malchut (Reign) [Yahuweh], and whatever you will prohibit upon the earth has been prohibited in haShamayim, and whatever you will allow upon the earth has been allowed in haShamayim."
Based on the wording and in context to this verse, it appears that whatever will be prohibited on earth is already a done deal in heaven, and whatever will be allowed on earth is already a done deal in heaven. ("The Scriptures" reads similarly.) Since Yahushua is giving Kephah 'a key' ("a means of gaining or preventing entrance, possession, or control", also "something that gives an explanation or provides a solution," etc.), does this not imply that He is giving him access to His pre-existing authority already established in haShamayim? (Praise be to the Eternally, Self-Existing One)
(The prophetic movement has had a field day with Mt. 16-19, and in some cases, quite pompishly so.)
Effren states that Malchut Yahuweh was mistranslated as 'kingdom of heaven'. I have read (as I'm sure many of you have also) that 'heaven' is often used in rabbinical writings as a reference to Yahuweh. Much like ha'Shem is used. (Hide-the-Name-game.)
Keeping in mind the rule of reading the before and after in Scriptural verses, I find Mt. 16:18 rather interesting as it relates to vs. 19. Here's Effren's translation from the du Tillet Hebrew: "And I say to you, that you are Kephah, and upon this kephah I will build my Qahal (assembly), and gates of tachtiyot (lowest parts of Sheol) will not prevail against you!"
Gates. . .a key. . .hmmmm. So if we get hemmed in by the adversary, and he closes his gates around us, because of Yahushua and our belief in Him, we have a key!
The 'a key' in the above translation is interesting. I read the following in a footnote on Mt. 16:19 in the "Recovery Version" (nothing to do with AA) New Testament: "According to history there were two keys. Peter used one on the day of Pentecost to open the gate so that the Jewish believers could enter the kingdom of the heavens (Acts 2:38-42), and he used the other in the house of Cornelius to open the gate so that the Gentile believers could enter (Acts 10:34-48).
I hadn't heard of this before. Have any of you?
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Joined: 7/3/2007(UTC)
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Shalom All,
This is getting interesting with CK's post. I'm sure that there is more out there regarding Kepha's understanding that the key to eternal life is in knowing Yahushua who leads the way to the Kingdom of Yahweh which is open to all people. What an incredible grace and mercy, and it ties in very well with bringing the message of the Kingdom of Yahweh to all the world. So instead of mixing it up with "I've got it, you do not, so I am boss" what we see is a prelude to undertaking the Great Commission with humility which is not to force salvation upon anyone but to declare that it is available in the very real Kingdom of Yahweh which will come either at the end of our physical lives* or in the next quarter century. Let's see if more posts can add to this topic.
(* When we die we do not know anything so when we are resurrected it will be like we just went to sleep and just woke up to a new reality.) |
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom. |
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Infact don't the call paradise the great forgetting? |
YHWH's ordinances are true, and righteous altogether.
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 Joined: 9/5/2007(UTC)
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It should be remembered in dealing with this passage that Kephas had just had, we presume, his first divine 'revelation' (thou art the annointed one). This was prophesy (discerning YHWH's will, not 'telling the future') in its truest sense, and it is prophesy that all the following verses are about (not Kephas). This is why Paul describes prophesy as the greatest of spiritual gifts for it is at the very root of the ekklesia.
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 Joined: 1/11/2012(UTC) Posts: 154 Location: TX Was thanked: 8 time(s) in 6 post(s)
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bitnet wrote:Hello All,
Does anyone have a proper translation of the following verse? Still uncertain what this really means.
Mat 16:19: "And I will give to you the keys of the kingdom of the heavens, and whatever you bind on the earth will have been bound in the heavens; and whatever you loose on the earth will have been loosed in the heavens." May I reintroduce this old thread? The matter of authorizing forgiveness prerogative for men/church is addressed well here page 22-24. Could someone direct me to an equivalent reference that addresses the "loosing/binding" thing? I appreciate your help.
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 Joined: 10/23/2007(UTC) Posts: 2,616 Location: Texas Thanks: 5 times
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I can't seem to find it now, and it may have been discussed on the radio and not in the book. But I seem to remember when Yada talked about it the gist of it being what ever you bind upon people on earth will be bound upon you. In other words the opposite of how it is interpreted. So when the Catholic Church says you can't eat meat on a Friday they will be judged by the standard that they implemented on others. |
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.
“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand |
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Joined: 1/11/2012(UTC) Posts: 154 Location: TX Was thanked: 8 time(s) in 6 post(s)
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Thanks James.
So, simply stated, the interpretation consistent with Yah's message reiterates that the judgment you impose on others now is already determined for you in heaven. Love others as yourself here and you'll be doing pretty well there. Stepping on toes here reduces the potential of your role there. The "You decide what's right and wrong. I'll apply your terms to My home" line is suspicious to say the least. That would put a lot of power in a few mortal hands ... and did just that - pure genius. I mean 'evil'.
If anyone happens upon the details, please share.
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 Joined: 9/5/2013(UTC)
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It should be remembered in dealing with this passage that Kephas had just had
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 Joined: 11/17/2013(UTC)
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Thanks James for engaging in the posted topic.There is no other place like
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