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Offline EI  
#1 Posted : Wednesday, July 4, 2007 7:18:58 AM(UTC)
EI
Joined: 7/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 98

I was having a conversation with a religious Jew and he was adamant with his statement that

"The form Yahshua is not based in the Hebrew language".

As he stated, "It is an attempt to ram the name Yah into the name Yeshua" which he describes as the name most would allow for the Hebrew reconstruction of the Syriac name Ishu(the name for Jesus The Peshitta).

He speaks Hebrew as a first language. It is hard to talk to Jews about this issue(atleast in my experiences up to this point).
Offline Jeannie  
#2 Posted : Wednesday, July 4, 2007 8:15:59 AM(UTC)
Jeannie
Joined: 6/27/2007(UTC)
Posts: 254
Woman
Location: Florida

EI, it's hard to talk to even born anew Jews about this. They really have a mind set and you just have to chip away at it. (with lots of prayer!)
Jeannie
Offline Yada  
#3 Posted : Thursday, July 5, 2007 7:23:12 PM(UTC)
Yada
Joined: 6/28/2007(UTC)
Posts: 3,537

The following extracts were taken from the article: Yahshua or Yeshua? What is the True Pronuniciation of the Messiahs Name? You can find the complete article in .pdf format here: http://yahstruth.org/Pub...ions/YahshuaorYeshua.pdf or in html: http://yahstruth.org/Pub...ions/YahshuaorYeshua.php

There are many more pertinent articles on the groups web site - Yahwehs Philadelphia Truth Congregation: www.YahsTruth.org

The Correct Pronunciation

Quote:
When looking at the various pronunciations offered in the Lexicons, bear in mind that they are based upon the vowel points that were added by the Masoretes several hundred years after the Messiah’s death. The Hebrew texts were originally written without vowel points. The vowel points were added by the Masoretes to help preserve the Hebrew pronunciations.

In Marks and Rogers “Handbook to Biblical Hebrew”, page 7, we have the following quote: “Originally Hebrew had no written vowels; the following consonants, however, were often used to indicate long vowels: a, h, w, y. When the Masoretes introduced their vowel signs, they added their signs to these consonants.” Notice that all of the letters which comprise Yahweh’s name are listed here.

As was pointed out previously, the Masoretes took certain liberties with the Sacred Name because of their belief that it was too holy to pronounce. For those who are fluent in Hebrew, the vowel points are not necessary for reading or understanding the text. It should be noted that the same “liberties” that were taken with Yahweh’s name were also applied to the Savior’s name in Hebrew. Because of these corrupted traditions it is necessary to disregard the vowel points when translating these names. Let’s take a look at these names as they appear in the Hebrew text.

We will first consider the name Yahweh. In the Hebrew it is written hwhy. Hebrew is written from right to left.The English transliteration is YHWH. These are four vowel letters. It is not necessary to have vowel points to pronounce this name. The first letter — yoth, is pronounced as a long Y sound, like the Y in heavy (an ee sound). The second letter— hay, is pronounced as a short A sound, like the A in father (an ah sound). The third letter— waw, is pronounced as a long U sound, like the OO in food (oo sound). The forth letter— hay, is pronounced as a short E sound, like the E in met (an eh sound). When we put these sounds together we get the correct pronunciation of the Heavenly Father’s Name, ee-ah-oo-eh, or as written in English, Yahweh.


Putting the Parts Together

Quote:
According to the previous definitions, the Savior’s name is the combination of two words. In the Strong’s Lexicon they are #3068—Yahweh and #3467—salvation. When we look at the Savior’s name in Hebrew it is written as . Again, Hebrew is written from right to left. Take notice of the first three letters of this name— . This is the contracted or abbreviated form of Yahweh’s name, pronounced as Yah.


It continues:

Quote:
Furthermore, we can site the Gesenius Hebrew-Chaldee Lexicon on Yah . This authoritative work shows the two forms of Yah as being and . It gives several examples in Hebrew showing how these two forms combine with other words to form proper nouns. Both of these forms are transliterated as Yah.

The Savior’s name is one of the many proper nouns in the scriptures that is compounded with the shortened form of Yahweh’s name, Yah. In this particular case it combines with the form of yahsa (salvation). From this evidence we can conclude that the Savior’s name must be pronounced as Yahshua and not Yeshua.


Finally:

Quote:
Judaism has for centuries sought to cover up the true pronunciation of Yahweh’s name. That same false notion has been perpetuated today by those who insist on using the corrupted form Yeshua rather than using the correct and proper form, Yahshua. Yahshua is truth while Yeshua is error. Our Savior said that His disciples are sanctified by the Truth, John 17:17.


-Yada
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Offline Noach  
#4 Posted : Thursday, July 5, 2007 7:25:26 PM(UTC)
Noach
Joined: 7/5/2007(UTC)
Posts: 127

Jeannie/EI

I would agree wholeheartedly with this. The name of Yahuwah seems to be the biggest obstacle in Jew's truly accepting salvation. Losing the Name of Yahuwah as has happened for Jew's has been the single most destructive consequence of their relationship with our Creator. It is our job to give them His Name as bad as they may think they have to fight it. I think it is the one thing they need so very badly and what they will be jealous for in time.

Noach
Offline EI  
#5 Posted : Saturday, July 7, 2007 10:55:33 AM(UTC)
EI
Joined: 7/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 98

Here is another article addressing the different forms of the Messiah's "possible names".


http://www.eliyah.com/yahushua.html
Offline Theophilus  
#6 Posted : Sunday, July 8, 2007 3:24:02 AM(UTC)
Theophilus
Joined: 7/5/2007(UTC)
Posts: 544
Man

Thanks: 4 times
I don't know if this will add much to the discusson, but I asked a lady I know from another forum who was culturally Jewish and recently bacame Messianic how she pronounces her preferred spelling "Yeshua". She answered "just like Joshua except replace the 'Josh' with a 'Yah'. This surprised me as I assumed it would be pronounced with a "Yesh" sound.

That makes me wonder if it is vocalized Yah, why not pronounce it such? Having received Hebrew classes from her youth, I realize that she will not accept the reasoning of a slow learning goyim like myself.

Offline Jeannie  
#7 Posted : Sunday, July 8, 2007 1:58:53 PM(UTC)
Jeannie
Joined: 6/27/2007(UTC)
Posts: 254
Woman
Location: Florida

I think this is a really good paper on the names that might help... http://realmessiah.name/pdf/name.pdf
Jeannie
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