I have oftened thought about this, I was baptized as an infant into the RCC. I have not been baptized since then, at least not physically in water. I have however been immersed in the Spirit for nearly three years now. I have considered being baptized in water again, but have not,

As far as in the name of the father the son and the holy spirit. Yahweh is the father, Yahweh is the son, and Yahweh is the Spirit, so I would want to be baptized in the name of Yahweh.

Just my thoughts.

Icy I have gone back and forth between what you’re saying, and the idea that the physical immersion in water is an outward symbol of the inward change. I am in complete agreement about not needing to go to a chrch and having a pastor pray to baal. If I decide to do it, I will probably do it myself, and be around fellow believers.

But I don't believe that baptism is necessary for salvation. I don't think it is necessarily wrong, if you’re doing it for the right reason. If you are doing it just because than it is pointless. I believe it was C.J. Kooster that said, “If you baptize a pagan, who doesn’t believe, all you get is a wet pagan.”

Thanks for the replies.
I was immersed in the Spirit before I was baptized in water. I know that water baptism is symbolic. When I went under the water I felt like I was under for an eternity even though it was only a few seconds. Maybe it felt like an eternity because I can’t swim very well ;)

James, Icy, and Swalchy,
Are you saying that water baptism is no longer required? Since when? after Pentecost?
If water baptism was never required then why did Yahushua insist that Yahuchanon (John) immerse and submerge Him in the Yardan river?

I know that no one in the Old Covenant was water baptized but surely they were immersed in the Spirit.


Swalchy,
I am copying some verses from Mattithyahu below from your web site for people to read and reflect upon. I appreciate your hard work in amplifying Mattithyahu and the other books. In Mattithyahu 28:18-20, is it possible that “immersing and submerging them in the proper and personal Name of The Father*, and of the Son*, and of the Set-apart Spirit*” means to teach people in the personal names and doesn't mean water baptism at all? I know that I have been immersed in studying YY, TOM, and FH lately. I still have a lot to read.


Mattithyahu 3:13-17
Then, at that time, Yahushua* arrived and approached, came forth, presented Himself and made His public appearance from Galilee at, by and before the Yardan, near, towards and by Yahuchanon to be immersed and submerged by him. But Yahuchanon tried to deter, prevent and hinder Him, saying and speaking; "I have necessity and need, duty and business to be immersed and submerged by and under You, and You appear, arise and come forth to me?"
But nevertheless, answering the question, Yahushua said to Him, "Permit, allow and do not hinder it now, at this time and at this very moment; for in this manner, way and likeness it is proper and becoming, seemly and fitting to us to fulfil and complete, consummate and furnish, to render perfect and to bring to realisation all that is righteous and right, virtuous and acceptable to the Supreme Ones standards and of being in a proper relationship with Him." Then, at that time, he permitted, allowed and didn't hinder Him. And having been immersed and submerged, Yahushua stood straight and upright, true and sincere, ascending and rising from the water; and suddenly, there and then the vaulted expanse of the sky with all things visible in it opened, and He saw and noticed, paid attention to and discovered, observed and looked upon the Spirit* of God* coming down and descending as if it were and as though it was like a dove, coming, appearing and coming forth upon Him, and suddenly, there and then a voice and sound, tone and uttered words came out of and from the vaulted expanse of the sky with all things visible in it and said, speaking and affirming, teaching and advising, directing and exhorting, maintaining and pointing out, "This is my Son*, the beloved and esteemed, dear, favourite and worthy of love, in whom I am well pleased and take pleasure in."


Mattithyahu 28:18-20

And Yahushua* came and drew near to them, approaching them, and He spoke to them saying and teaching, maintaining and exhorting, advising and directing, affirming and pointing out, "All individual and collective power and might, strength and ability, authority and jurisdiction in Heaven and on the land and ground, district, region and earth has been given and granted, supplied and furnished, bestowed and delivered, extended and present to Me. Then and therefore, accordingly, consequently and these things being so, go away and depart, pursuing your journey, and make followers and disciples, pupils and learners, instructing and teaching all the individual and collective multitudes and races, specifically Gentiles, peoples and nations; large groups based upon religious, political, cultural and geographic ties, immersing and submerging them in the proper and personal Name of The Father*, and of the Son*, and of the Set-apart Spirit*, teaching and imparting instruction, discoursing and explaining to them to guard and attend to carefully, keep and observe all the individual and collective things, as many as I have commanded and ordered you, and behold, I am with you all the individual and collective days until the completion, consummation and end of the world, the end of the age of man."

Good discussion.

I came across this passage from Alexander Hislop's The Two Babylons (thanks Jeannie) and thought I would post it here. It is taken from pages 125 - 126:

Thanks for everyone’s input. My original important question has been answered. No need for me to be water baptized again.

Definitely being immersed in the Spirit is the most important thing. I will leave you with these verses from John. These verses are copied from The Scriptures 1998+ in e-Sword. I couldn’t find an amplified version of these verses.

Joh 3:3 יהושע answered and said to him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born from above, he is unable to see1 the reign of Elohim.” Footnote: 1Or perceive.
Joh 3:4 Naḵdimon said to Him, “How is a man able to be born when he is old? Is he able to enter into his mother’s womb a second time and be born?”
Joh 3:5 יהושע answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he is unable to enter into the reign of Elohim.
Joh 3:6 “That which has been born of the flesh is flesh, and that which has been born of the Spirit is spirit.
Joh 3:7 “Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You have to be born from above.’
Joh 3:8 “The Spirit1 breathes where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who has been born of the Spirit.” Footnote: 1Or wind.

It doesn't matter what we think. This is a simple matter of obedience. The "great commission" as recounted by Matthew records Yahshua's words: "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." (Matthew 28:18-20) If His disciples were to baptize those who were entering the ekklesia, it is axiomatic that they--the new disciples--were supposed to be baptized. Yes, it's "only" symbolic. So what? Virtually the entire Torah is "only" symbolic. Like the Torah's precepts, baptism doesn't in itself save anyone. But that's no reason to refuse to do it. Just as the Torah's instructions were to be a sign to the world, so is believer's baptism---a sign, a memorial, a testimony. Why can't we just do what God said to do without questioning His motives or purpose?

kp

It seems like religion always get things wrong when they try to make rules out of what Yahweh said, if they would just say what he said things would be better, KP points that out with regard to the Ram Bam in TOM

I'll do it :D - dont worry, I wont hold you under...











...for too long...






... ;)






but seriously, I will :)

As I noted above, Yahshua Himself answered the question of "Whose name" we are baptized into, Tiffany: "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." (Matthew 28:18-20) Unless somebody can prove that we have a case of textual tampering here, I'm good with that answer.

kp

Well said, Mel, and welcome to the forum. Yes, it's a crying shame that so many who are perfectly happy to baptize in "the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" haven't a clue as to what that name is.

kp

Consider, if you will, the ramifications of the witness or testimony of a continuance in the truth of Yahweh and the deliverance you have become aware of, versus the continued adherence to an awareness of truth that used to be, which was housed in a neat package that you may have discovered has at least in part been untrue. To cling to that which is profane is to not step up to the plateau of True Truth as it has been revealed. One has to be adhered to. Should compromise be the watchword? The condemning or approving judgment is not ours to exercise; but discernment of truth is, and if we are to continue in like manner of the exercise of the faith of Abraham then we must take the action that our newfound conviction of truth proscribes. Obedience to what the Father has made each of us aware of is a call that only the individual who hears can truly perform. I ask that the Spirit of Truth guide your heart, and make you totally prepared for the path you are being called to. Watch your steps, the path is truly narrow.

Peace be! As a newbie to this forum, I am obliged to read and learn before I speak. And this is one place where I think I may speak a little. Having been called 20 years ago, and finding The Truth in bits and pieces over the past two decades culminating in Yada Yahweh today, I am of the opinion that Scripture asks each of us to share His Word and immerse the listener with the Good News of salvation. Just letting them hear and understand the real reasons for Life and that our temporal discourse on this material plane is but a trial for the joys of Eternity as part of His Family is already a blessing.

In the past I had fellowshipped with others in another congregation who have had some of the Truth, and been baptised in 1993 in water "In the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit". I do not place much value on that now as the actual name of our Father and Saviour was not used but I do appreciate that I was and am immersed in the Ruach. I am still more interested in being immersed in the Ruach and knowing the Creator and Saviour than in water immersion, whether for me, my wife or others. I am no saint and I still do some things that are detestable but as each day goes by I am drawn closer to The Eternal Creator and am slowly changing with the (hopefully) growing presence of the Ruach within me.

Keeping His Sabbaths and Feasts properly in today's world is another area I would like to have advice upon other than a public affirmation of being adopted into His Family. The one good thing I see about physical water immersion is that it brings us together physically, as someone else has to be present. Fellowship is something I yearn for desperately in my little corner of the world in Malaysia. I have shared YY with some people and only one other person has responded positively despite protests by his wife, children and current congregation. We meet sometimes but feel "alone" here despite knowing that we are not alone. So if someone among you would like to visit Kuala Lumpur for a holiday and dunk me in my condominium's pool, you would be most welcome!

Hello Real,

What am I doing in Malaysia? That should be a question for my parents and their ancestors who travelled far and wide from their origins spanning more than 6000 miles over centuries! I am only a result of their love. :-) And from what I gather, called by Yahweh to express His love for all, especially those whom He has called into His Family. Doctrine, you say... well, there is a doctrine (if you can call it that) that says we should love Yahweh and each other... and other 10 "doctrines" regarding how we should fulfill these two commandments. Trouble is, most of the world cannot agree how far down these 10 doctrines should be practised. We on the other hand, know what is required of us for us to partake of the gifts that Father Yahweh has in store for us. Perhaps we stand alone in that we do not condemn anyone seeking Truth, but we are firm in that none should blaspheme Yahweh or His blessed implement of salvation, Yahushua, or the Ruach Qodesh, Yahweh's Set-Apart Spirit who guides us and nourishes us. Personally I also do not condemn those who ignore or refuse Yahweh's plan and I am fully aware that the people of the world shall bring troubles upon themselves and the "innocent" that have not yet seen the light of day. It is not my place to judge and condemn, and Yahweh shall do the necessary when the time is right in each and every circumstance. He is always willing and able to rescue those who seek and call Him properly, even in the end of days, so it is not up to us to reject anyone at any time unless it is evident that their actions are against revealed Truth and continue to aggrieve the Set-Apart Spirit in the Ekklesia. That said, being set-apart does not mean that we cannot unite together some days as is commanded. So no matter where we all are, near you in the West or in the Far East, we should gather "two or three in Yahushua's name" at the appointed times to "plead our case" for ourselves, our families and friends, the nations around us and those called from within them to The Family.

KP, maybe you can speak to this better than anybody, but I do not recollect a specific instruction from Yahuwah in the TaNaKh in regards to water immersion for the purpose of acceptance by the Set Apart Spirit. There are specific instances where cleansing was required but not a general instruction to dip ourselves in water to recieve the Spirit. If I am right and there is no instruction in this regard than Yahushua would not add a new commandment specifically requiring water immersion to recieve the Spirit, as He did not come to add or take away from the Torah. There is no doubt that water immersion as an outward symbol of the decision to recieve the Spirit was taking place and recorded, and that even Yahushua performed it, but could this have been a tradition of man and not necessarily a Torah prescription.

Noah

I recently saw the questions: Why was Jesus baptized?

Do you guys think is was in fulfillment of Exodus 29:4? "Then [Moses must] bring Aaron and his sons to the entrance to the Tent of Meeting and wash them with water." But I don't think this has do with being baptized. I can only think that Yahshua performed the baptism as a symbolic gesture of the real thing, being washed of our sins and receiving the Spirit, and asked us to do accordingly.