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Offline gammafighter  
#1 Posted : Sunday, November 11, 2007 6:23:16 PM(UTC)
gammafighter
Joined: 11/6/2007(UTC)
Posts: 114
Man
Location: Hilo, Hawaii

Hey everyone!
I'm just curious what everyone does to observe the Sabbath. I'm talking specifically about gathering and everything. We might need another topic to discuss whether or not something is considered work, unless that's already been done or there's scripture that I don't know about that helps us determine that.

The reason I'm wondering about what everyone else does on Sabbath is because I'm going to be trying to get people to gather on Saturdays starting either this coming week or the following week. Some direction and advice would be helpful.

Currently, I'm planning on introducing everyone to the corruption of "Church" and everything that "Christians" do wrong without even knowing it. Hopefully, that will lead to some discussion. I'm trying to appeal to both Christians and "seekers" and "free spirits" (people who aren't sure what to believe, but aren't as certain in their uncertainty as Agnostics). There's no shortage of either here on the Big Island of Hawaii. I'm planning on calling it "God Damn Religion: The Sins of the Church". I'm friends with most of the Christians I'll invite, so I can explain to them that it's not against YHWH, but against religion. I made pamphlets. I noted on their that it's for people with "an open mind and a thirst for the truth."

I figure I can really only plan one week out for now because the following weeks will depend on who (if anyone) wants to keep coming and what they want to talk about. Some people who really don't like Christianity might want to hear my take on the Scripture and some evidence for it. Some people might be Christians who want to find out more about the corruption of the Church so they can undo it in their lives and hopefully even the church I attend.

So how do you observe the Sabbath?
Offline shalom82  
#2 Posted : Sunday, November 11, 2007 7:33:36 PM(UTC)
shalom82
Joined: 9/10/2007(UTC)
Posts: 735
Location: Penna

Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
How long would your meeting be? It depends on how long it was as to what you could do. Would your get together be on friday night or Saturday?

At some point I would probably have a meal. Nothing brings people together and makes 'em wanna stay like food. You could have an oneg shabbat on Friday evening or Saturday.

Have a meet and greet time

Present a message, perhaps do the Torah reading and have a discussion

Have prayer time

maybe teach them a song.

You could teach them to sing the shema. I find that people always love to pick up tidbits of a foreign language no matter what the language is.If you need a melody to set it to I can give you a link. Or for that matter you could teach certain Hebrew greetings or words of significance.

Then you can have a nice scriptual meal. You can add little touches to the meal that add flavor and make spiritual points.

Ex. Have bowls of olive oil for people to dip their bread in and explain that is was the common way in which Israelites ate their bread. And really break the bread with your hands instead of a knife. You can explain the significance of olive oil and how it represents Yahuweh and all his manifestations As the giver of light, the healer, and the nourisher.

If you can play an instrument play an instrument, if you can dance teach people a dance. Keep it fun and focused on Yahuweh.

I would say if you have never had a meeting before that you should have it be informal and relaxing. Don't deliver a sermon, or at least don't deliver it in a common way. Try to get the people involved. Invite them to read and to contribute as much as possible.

I would say that you should take a softer approach if this is your first meeting. Don't make them feel like you are lording anything over them and I am not trying to criticize but your title may be a little strong for a first meeting. I am not saying don't tell the truth or anything like that, but if people start coming back and it becomes a regular thing then you can start giving them more solid food. Don't be afraid to give them a little milk first.

You don't need to take my advice really except for this: Keep it fun and focused on Yahuweh. So I guess I rambled on. But I really hope it will go well for you:)
Shalom,
Jake
YHWH's ordinances are true, and righteous altogether.
Offline gammafighter  
#3 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2007 12:58:03 AM(UTC)
gammafighter
Joined: 11/6/2007(UTC)
Posts: 114
Man
Location: Hilo, Hawaii

Thank you, Jake. I really appreciate your input. I will very seriously consider it. Good thing I didn't print the pamphlets yet! I guess I just like to be up front with people. Like "Here's what I believe, it's scripturally supported here, here, and here. If you don't like it, you can leave." The problem is that most people leave! Not that I think we should sugarcoat the truth. I just think there's a lot better ways to present the truth. As with a human relationship, maybe it's not best to be so in-your-face right from the start.

I don't know a lot about modern or traditional Jewish culture (let alone what parts are inspired by Yahweh and what parts are purely man-made), but I was planning on having it Saturday afternoon. Friday night would be good, except (this requires some explaining) my local church has a movie night as an outreach at our house on Fridays. The idea is to have a discussion about the movie with a spiritual focus, to get unbelievers to start thinking about spiritual things. So it is supposed to be an event where we are (very gently) nudging people in the right direction instead of shoving it down their throat. I think a Sabbath observance might be too obvious, lol. It would be awesome if I could get that to work though, as a lot of people would already be gathering at my house. Thank you again, you've given me a lot to think about.
Offline Icy  
#4 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2007 3:41:55 AM(UTC)
Icy
Joined: 9/5/2007(UTC)
Posts: 641
Man
Location: Virginia Beach, VA

Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
While Jake's suggestions are great, I think they are a little more than you want for your target audience. I believe that if you did all of that, most of those people would just think that you were trying to tell them to observe Judaism. You probably want to start with a relaxed atmosphere and just touch on or hint at those things that are wrong in the church. Even though your stated focus is to expose the errors in the church today, any of the current believers will feel like you are attacking them if you come on strong. Although, the free spirits and seekers might be very open to a strong approach showing the errors of the church.
Offline shalom82  
#5 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2007 8:41:30 AM(UTC)
shalom82
Joined: 9/10/2007(UTC)
Posts: 735
Location: Penna

Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
That really could be true Icy, I guess I got a little carried away. Like I always do...haha.
Take care
YHWH's ordinances are true, and righteous altogether.
Offline Heretic Steve  
#6 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2007 10:11:34 AM(UTC)
Heretic Steve
Joined: 9/26/2007(UTC)
Posts: 258
Location: ohio

I've a little experience at this, that is, trying to convey scrip vs the "Bible", explaining the diff between relationship and religion, as well as the misconceptions/mithraic syncretisms in/of the christian religion. Here's what I've found, they are not well received to say the least. Go to any christian forum, start teaching what YY conveys and you'll soon understand what I'm talking about. I've also tried to comunicate the truths in scrip/YY to family members who are lifelong church members. They took offense. I was actually kicked out of a public christian buffet/restaurant, (Ernest Angly's place) when other customers overheard me talking and complained to the management about what I was saying. The managment evesdropped on my conversation and then asked me to leave.
Maybe instead of jumping right on the hard stuff, (the pope is/was a nazi, the christian religion is a satanic babylonian counterfeit, the catholic church is the "seat of Satan", the "Lord" is Baal/satan, etc.), try easing into the issues. First, try explaining Abraham's relationship with Yahweh, that Yahweh wanted Abe to walk, talk, be conversant, feel at ease, and "be straight with Him", in other words, casual, frank, friendly, conversation. From there, maybe you could then discuss the Miqrim of Passover, Unlevened Bread, First fruits, Seven Seven's, Trumpets, Yowm Kippurim, and Tabernacles, and how these are prophetic and play out in Yah's redemption plan. It's likely your friends have never heard of this and they may become curious. If so, let their questions lead. Basically, I think you'll want to ease them into the program, so to speak, and avoid the hard sell, (at least at first). Maybe after a few meetings you can get into the more unsavory issues of Babylonian syncretism and idolotry by explaining Yahushua's address to each of the 7 Ekklesia as found in Rev.
You may also want to comprehensively learn Dan 9. The prophecy conveying the precise timeline as to Yahushua's arrival in Jerusalem should impress them. YY explains/delineates this chronolgy magnificently.
And last but not least, try not to become discouraged. Admittedly this may be easier said than done.
If not us, who? If not now, when?
Offline Juski  
#7 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2007 12:05:27 PM(UTC)
Juski
Joined: 7/6/2007(UTC)
Posts: 114
Location: Salford, UK

Hello

We have jsut formally started Friday night meetings. Its early days for us so still finding our way but we have an open house, and cook a big stew or something and serve it with crusty bread, while we eat we just chat about where we are at, challenges from the week, questions people have been thinking about, and just see where it goes. We only have 4 people at the mo so it is very informal, if it feels 'right' we'll have some worship time too. In the long run we will hopefully get more people coming along and we'll do some Bible study or discuss specific issues like feasts. But for now we're jsut trying to meet the needs of the people that show up.

I think its great that you are so passionate about this, but be wary in how you start off, you dont want to scare people away by being too in your face in the first meeting, take time to get to know the people that are coming along. It is a lot to take in, for us its been a 2 year journey of discovery so far, you need to bear in mind that even though you have got your head round all these issues it will take a long time for others to get it, and to want to get it.

Remember that you are modelling this way of life for others, you dont have to get it perfect, but display love, intergrity, etc. People will be drawn to you if you reflect YHWH.
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