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Offline Ben219  
#1 Posted : Saturday, April 13, 2013 2:04:42 PM(UTC)
Ben219
Joined: 4/13/2013(UTC)
Posts: 2

Hi everybody,
I'm new to the forum and decided to finally get on the forum because I have some very crucial questions I can't seen to get answered. Alright, so over the last several weeks I have ran into some skeptics and Radical Critics. A lot of times they focus on NT criticism and I can find errors in their theories. Anyway I came across several books by Ralph Ellis and I am having a very hard time with them. This guy is making some BIG claims. His book "King Jesus" theorizes that Yahoshua was actually the historic Jesus of Gamala and was an Egyptian King. He theorizes in other books that the Patriarchs (Moses, David, etc.) were all Egyptian. He also claims Saul/ Paul of Tarsus was Josephus and that Yahowshua, "Jesus" wasn't crucified until the 70's AD, and then escapes alive to die in 98 AD. He basically revises all of scripture. He states this historical Jesus figure was a leader of a Galilean sect, and Paul(Josephus) started a rival sect called "Simple Judaism". He also redacted when Yahoshua was born.
Well all this sounds pretty radical, but some of his evidence and dating methods do make you think. You can read portions of his books for free at Google Books. I definitely am not advocating his works. I feel the need to answer criticism head on and factually. The information presented by this book raise the stakes pretty high. I'm very tired from trying to answer his books Scriptural criticism and need some help. He draws parallels between Yahoshua and this Jesus of Gamala as well as parallels to other Scriptural characters and historical figures. He draws upon Josephus a lot to back up his claims.
Thank You
Offline Richard  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, April 16, 2013 12:13:10 PM(UTC)
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Joined: 1/19/2010(UTC)
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Well, we have from you that Ralph Ellis allegedly says several pretty outlandish things, but you do not provide us with any of his proofs, such as links to photos of ancient documents and the like. Josephus was a historian who faithfully served his Roman captors, so I don't put a whole lot of stock into his accounts, especially since he deliberately chose to follow rabbinical thinking rather than Yahowah's Torah.

From Yahowah we have received reliable, verified intel regarding who, what, when, and where. How is one fellow going to discredit all that voluminous documentation with a few "Look what I can imagine!" declarations? Give me a major break.

My counsel to you and to everyone else who keeps going far afield in an attempt to learn something new and world-changing is to stop it with that crap and focus on your relationship with Yahowah by becoming more and more familiar with His Torah.
Offline cgb2  
#3 Posted : Wednesday, April 17, 2013 2:00:11 AM(UTC)
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Joined: 5/14/2010(UTC)
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Seems there's a lot of book $eller$ and such making outlandish claims. I would think there is some scholarly rebuttals if you google search.

Amazing the stuff that goes as truth to tickle ears and sell books & movies. Take the movie Zeitgeist and 1/3rd of the movie painting EVERYTHING as sun god religion. It presented false similarities (lies), easily debunked by actual evidence of religious myth beliefs.
Offline Ben10  
#4 Posted : Wednesday, April 17, 2013 1:15:59 PM(UTC)
Ben10
Joined: 4/16/2013(UTC)
Posts: 2
Location: Northwest, Indiana

flintface wrote:
Well, we have from you that Ralph Ellis allegedly says several pretty outlandish things, but you do not provide us with any of his proofs, such as links to photos of ancient documents and the like. Josephus was a historian who faithfully served his Roman captors, so I don't put a whole lot of stock into his accounts, especially since he deliberately chose to follow rabbinical thinking rather than Yahowah's Torah.

From Yahowah we have received reliable, verified intel regarding who, what, when, and where. How is one fellow going to discredit all that voluminous documentation with a few "Look what I can imagine!" declarations? Give me a major break.

My counsel to you and to everyone else who keeps going far afield in an attempt to learn something new and world-changing is to stop it with that crap and focus on your relationship with Yahowah by becoming more and more familiar with His Torah.


Yeah, this author's claims definitely do sound insane. One major thing I've taken away from YY and Intro to God is the importance of facts and knowing in a relationship with God. This is the reason why I feel compelled to check out the claims of critics and try to refute them. I just feel that in order to have the kind of "knowing" relationship apparently required in Scripture, we've got to keep are heads up on claims like this.
The author's major theories are that The Exodus in Scripture was the Hyksos exodus of Egypt. He tries to trace the decendents of these people up to Jesus of Gamala/ King Izas of Adeabene-who he says is Yahowshua. I don't like to say it but his arguments are rather compelling and the dozens of parallels documented between certain people and groups make you think. His evidence includes documentation from Manetho about Egypt. He also notes apparent inconsistencies in traditional dating. Then again, my problems might be due to my untrained mind. I've looked high and low for some in depth rebuttals of his work online but can't seem to find any. I can't just dismiss it because it is unpopular though...
These things bother me because I feel I have to deal with these claims. Sorry if I sound like a basket case, I just need some serious help/advice....
Btw, this is the same person as Ben219...just lost my password and couldn't log on
Offline James  
#5 Posted : Wednesday, April 17, 2013 3:52:16 PM(UTC)
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Okay so i just did a quick google of this guy, found his website and the first thing that caught my eye was a link to a "debate" he had with a detractor. From there I found a number of rebuttals of his methodology and theories.

I read enough on how he has twisted and misrepresented the etymology of names and words to not put stock in any of his other research. It seems much of his thinking is that words that transliterate into English similarly share an origin and are the same. He apparently uses this with names frequently to say that jebus is this guy or that. A good example of how this is completely absurd and wrong is the Spanish word embarazado, which transliterated sound an awful lot like the English word embarrassed, this sticks out to me because my Spanish teacher in high school told us about how when she was first learning the language and didn't know it too well she did something stupid and said in Spanish, "I'm so embarrazado" thinking it meant embarrassed in Spanish only to be looked at like an idiot. In Spanish the word embarazado means pregnant, nothing even close to the English embarrassed. The lesson of the story she said was that just because two words sound similar doesn't make them similar. It seems that Ellis never learned that lesson.

As for the rest of his claims I don't have the time or inclination to read them or refute them, this alone is enough for me to know I shouldn't waste my time on him.

Here are a few links to sites I found which refute him:

http://gilgamesh42.wordp...olarship-of-ralph-ellis/

http://aramaicdesigns.bl...a-by-ralph-ellis-er.html

http://danielomcclellan....13/04/10/on-ralph-ellis/

Time would be better spent studying the Towrah then reading anything this guy writes.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
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