 Joined: 10/23/2007(UTC) Posts: 2,616  Location: Texas Thanks: 5 times
Was thanked: 216 time(s) in 149 post(s)
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I was working on some translations today and came across a perfect example of why the Christian view of the flood is errant.
If 'erets is the Earth as Christians are want to say it is concerning the flood, then this verse is God telling Ya'aqob to leave the Earth he is in and return to the Earth of his relatives.
Ba'reshiyth 31:13
Now (attah) stand up (qum – rise up), go (yatsa’ - depart) from this land (‘erets – region and area) and return (suwb – come back and be restored) to the land (‘erets – region and area) of your relatives (‘atah moledeth - your kin and family, your birthplace and origins). |
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.
“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand |
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 Joined: 1/19/2010(UTC) Posts: 695  Thanks: 4 times
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And, since no spacecraft is mentioned, it is obvious that Ya'aqob was into advanced teleporting. So why don't all those televangelists and megachurch "pastors" teleport the heck outta here?! |
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 Joined: 7/5/2007(UTC) Posts: 544 Thanks: 4 times
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James you make a good case, although I doubt most would casual Christians would question the popular translations enough to examine the underlying Hebrew texts , figuring the translators must have it right since it is reinforced by relegious authorities and is rarely questioned.
What puzzles me, is why Erets has so many plausible meanings dependig on what the context is. I recently was discussing Genesis chapter one with a few Christians and wish to share the amplified YY rendering of the chapter and realize that Erets is conveyed as the material universe as well which I wish a more specific Hebrew word was available to make the distictions: region, land, planet Earth, all physical matter. While I think YY has it correct, I wish that we could more definity make it apparent to a sincere seeker of Yah's truth.
Respectfully,
-Theophilus
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 Joined: 3/13/2008(UTC) Posts: 212 Location: Southern Wisconsin Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
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Easier said than done. It seems that with most all Hebrew words, there are many definitions, and in some cases there is even kind of opposite definitions. As an example, look at the word:
kabed – very significant and valuable, worthy and massive, distinguished and honorable, glorified and rewarding, numerous, burdensome, weighty, voluminous, troubling, grievous, severe, harsh.
So is it valuable or is it troubling and grievous??
I have come to find that translating is an art, not a science.
Context Context Context
Also, specific to Erets... a good point to make is that if Yah had wanted to say that the water would flood the “world,” rather than land or region, He would have used tebel. It means “world” as in the “habitable portion of the planet.”
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Joined: 7/5/2007(UTC) Posts: 544 Thanks: 4 times
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FWIW, I agree with you YT, that trnsalting does indeed seem to be more of an art than a science, but wish that were otherwise.
From my recent early Genesis conversations, it seems to me that people who view Adam as the first humanoid, vey often need a global flood event, while a first human with a neshamah permits a vast regional flood to accomplish the what it appears to me to the texts say occur. I'm not sure if these are abosultely tied, but seems to be the trend. Also the young earth global flood position seems to me to more supported by the popular translations, while the first with neshamah, targeted flood may require amplified Hebrew renderings.
Respectfully,
-Theophilus
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 Joined: 2/18/2008(UTC) Posts: 309  Location: Colorado
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Someone posted a link to the internet here on the forum within the last month--I can't remember what the subject was; can someone refresh my memory?
Thanks
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Joined: 3/13/2008(UTC) Posts: 212 Location: Southern Wisconsin Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
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Theo, just want to say I complete agree with that. That does seem to be the trend. Also, it seems to me that most people who believe in young earth and Adam being the first human tend to be the same ones who don't care about amplified Hebrew renderings because they have enough faith to believe whatever their preacher tells them. I find it to be a waste of time to even talk about it with that sort of folk until I stumble across one that is actually searching for the unbiased truth.
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 Joined: 5/19/2011(UTC)
Posts: 197
Location: US
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Does anyone have a true translation of Daniel
6:10. I have tried but mine sounds like
something out of an islam book to me. Facing
Jerusalem on his knees 3 times a day. Or do I
have it close and am misunderstanding? I
thought we are suppose to stand as in walking.
Help somebody.I'm not nearly as good as you guys.
Think I'm mostly confusing myself. Need to leave the
translating to those who know what they are doing.
Thanks in advance
By the way, James, do you have an updated Ba'reshiyth?
Thanks again
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 Joined: 1/29/2011(UTC)
Posts: 874
Location: Houston, Texas
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If I read prayer right, I think it's no more than speaking with, God. If that's the case, then I far exceed their request every day. Upper room may indicate lower windows, and to look out you may have to kneel.
Psalms 55:17 “Evening, and morning, and at noon, will I pray, and cry aloud: and he
shall hear my voice.”
Evening would indicate, new day.
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Joined: 10/23/2007(UTC) Posts: 2,616 Location: Texas Thanks: 5 times
Was thanked: 216 time(s) in 149 post(s)
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I don't have a translation of that verse, and don't have my Logos with me today, but at first glance I would say that this is only describing one man's habit, it is not an instruction for us to follow.
There is nothing in Scripture that prescribes a specific way we are suppose to pray.
No I don't have any updates for Ba'reshiyth. Work and home have been very busy lately so I have not had much time to work on translating. And now that summer is here I will be busy for a while. Hopefully after summer I will have more time. |
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.
“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand |
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Joined: 5/19/2011(UTC)
Posts: 197
Location: US
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Thanks, Hope you enjoy you summer. You sure earn
it during winter. That goes for all our translators.
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