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Offline PatrickM  
#1 Posted : Friday, December 23, 2011 12:26:09 PM(UTC)
PatrickM
Joined: 12/17/2011(UTC)
Posts: 20

Just something I just read that makes me wonder. What do you
guys think about this here:

http://www.askelm.com/doctrine/d910501.htm

Are we actually doing the wrong thing by trying to figure out the
name of God?

Thanks,
Patrick
Offline Yah Tselem  
#2 Posted : Friday, December 23, 2011 12:45:16 PM(UTC)
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No we are not doing the wrong thing. He plainly had the scribes write down His name 7,000 times, so He clearly wants us to know it and use it. The problem is that people have tried for centuries to cover it up, saying ridiculous things like 'there are no vowels so it can't be pronounced' or 'it is too sacred to pronounce'... those guys are nincompoops.. it's perfectly fine to use His name and we're not trying to figure it out, we already know it, it's YHWH, pronounced Yahowah. :)
Offline FredSnell  
#3 Posted : Saturday, December 24, 2011 2:01:14 PM(UTC)
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Just asking, Patrick, have you read any ITG, or the first three pages in the YY site? If you don't think by using, Lord, or JC, isn't blasphemous, then you have yet to walk from religion. Walk away from all of it. Don't listen to any of them and never rely upon their promises b/c the promise of The Covenant is what you seek. You are still holding onto their old ways and to know Yah, you leave all that, that put you into the bondage of your religion, behind you. Salvation is not provided as a gift to those who place their "faith in the Gospel of Grace."
Replacing Yah's name with "ha ba'al – the Lord" is the single most deceptive crime ever done to mankind by those claiming to speak on behalf of God. You have that right if you choose, you can follow man and his deadly deceptions, or choose to use the Creators one true Name and observe His Word along with His festivals, and you can without being worried of eternal damnation, but finding YHWH, is by finding the path and learning that His Towrah is what illuminates His path and leads you to Him. Abraham observed His Torah!
Offline cgb2  
#4 Posted : Saturday, December 24, 2011 6:07:11 PM(UTC)
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That llink was a hoot. Greek inspired language of scripture...snicker. Typical tactic of twisting isolated verses totally out of context. Seems the only reason there aren'nt extant Hebrew NT manuscripts is because the church burned them after torturing and murdering "heretics" caught with them
Offline In His Name  
#5 Posted : Saturday, December 24, 2011 6:25:58 PM(UTC)
In His Name
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PatrickM wrote:
Just something I just read that makes me wonder. What do you
guys think about this here:

http://www.askelm.com/doctrine/d910501.htm

Are we actually doing the wrong thing by trying to figure out the
name of God?

Thanks,
Patrick


Sorry Patrick, I couldn't get past the first sentence:

askelm.com wrote:
The earliest texts of the New Testament were canonized in the Greek language.


1. The New Testament is not Scripture
2. They were "canonized" by the RELIGION OF CHRISTIANITY not by Father Yahowah.

There is a lot of good information out there, but you are not going to find very much of it on christian websites like this.

We keep repeating ourselves, asking you to read Yada Yahweh and Introduction to God, for good reason. It is the single most clarifying presentation of Yahowah's word that any of us have found. (sorry everyone if I have overstepped on that statement). I/we are not trying to get you to drink the kool-aid. We are trying to show you the way to the answers you keep asking questions to. Please, stop wasting your time with askelm sites, focus on YY or ITG.
“Because he clings to Me, is joined to Me, loves and delights in Me, desires Me, therefore I will deliver him, carry him safely away, cause him to escape from harm making him inaccessible and strong, and delivering him safely to heaven, because he has known, observed, cared for, recognized, instructed and advised others to use, designated, acknowledged, discerned, answered in, My name, authority, character, report, mark, and nature." Psalm 91:14
Offline PatrickM  
#6 Posted : Monday, December 26, 2011 6:53:04 AM(UTC)
PatrickM
Joined: 12/17/2011(UTC)
Posts: 20

Hello All,

Yes, I am reading "Introduction To God" and am loving it. It's
a breath of fresh air.

Look guys, I'm new to this. I've been pulled out of the christian
church a long time ago. I also tried getting involved in the
"Hebrew Roots Movement", but found that most of those were
just another church organization. As I stated in another thread,
I've been doing this all on my own (of course it's been Yah who's
been leading me).

I do not have access to original manuscripts or anything like that.
I have a KJV, NKJV, and a Strongs. Most of what I've learned has
been through Yah's teaching anyway, it had nothing to do with my
Strongs or any teacher.

It's pretty obvious that there is a lot more to Yah's Word than what's
been told for so long. I found much of it reading my KJV without a
pastor whispering in my ear.

I believe Yah has brought me here to receive what I've been praying
for, for a long time now. I've known there is much more to His Word,
but couldn't (until now) find it.

I know Yah is calling me out from all of the brainwashing that I've
been under, so if I ask a question that goes against the grain, please
be a little patient with me. I'm more than willing to learn, and want
too with all my heart.

I'll make you all a promise... I will not post any more questions until
I have finished reading "Introduction To God" unless it's a question
about "Introduction To God" itself.

Thanks, I appreciate any and all help that's offered.

Shalom,
Patrick
Offline tagim  
#7 Posted : Sunday, April 29, 2012 4:15:39 AM(UTC)
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Welcome to the forum, Spada. It may be because of your native language that I do not understand your question. Would you please clarify it?
Offline FredSnell  
#8 Posted : Sunday, April 29, 2012 4:38:51 AM(UTC)
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tagim wrote:
Welcome to the forum, Spada. It may be because of your native language that I do not understand your question. Would you please clarify it?


Sales gimmick, Bill. He's just like those baby carrier sales ppl. And if I could rip their arms off and feed them to them, I wouldn't, but boy do I think about it...lol

And you, Bill, that days coming when I get you off on some far off planet, and make you wrestle me for your next meal..I'm gonna bring that old marine out of you once again. And if by some long shot you best me...lol. We'll meet on the next distant star and have another go at it.
Love ya bro, and pick up that phone next time I call.
Offline Richard  
#9 Posted : Wednesday, May 2, 2012 3:02:36 PM(UTC)
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You two kids settle down. Don't make me come back there!
Offline Noel  
#10 Posted : Sunday, August 26, 2012 9:46:47 PM(UTC)
Noel
Joined: 9/27/2009(UTC)
Posts: 92
Location: UK

Help.!

Has anyone seen the other point of view on the name of God.

http://jesus-messiah.com/studies/sacred-name.html

Now I don't go along with this, but you have to admit it is a detailed study. Pastor Cohen Reckart says that the name of God is EHYEH which is translated into Jesus.

He accuses people who think Yahwah is God's name as being unsaved.

I know this is a bit extreme, but I am concerned at the level of study which he has done to get to his view. Is there any truth in all this and who is this guy anyway?

Noel
Offline FredSnell  
#11 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 1:36:59 AM(UTC)
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Hi Noel.
I looked at the page until his little game popped up that he plays. Isn't it something that guy wants you to announce jesus name before you can continue, and renounce YHWH. So all these religions including Islam that use the name jesus, including catholicicsm, and all the protestant sisters that come from that place, are right according to him. I didn't play his little game, so not much I could make out of it. All these occultist popes, freemasons are right then. Is that what he's saying? We truely are in the, "dark ages."
Offline James  
#12 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 4:31:35 AM(UTC)
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Noel wrote:
Help.!

Has anyone seen the other point of view on the name of God.

http://jesus-messiah.com/studies/sacred-name.html

Now I don't go along with this, but you have to admit it is a detailed study. Pastor Cohen Reckart says that the name of God is EHYEH which is translated into Jesus.

He accuses people who think Yahwah is God's name as being unsaved.

I know this is a bit extreme, but I am concerned at the level of study which he has done to get to his view. Is there any truth in all this and who is this guy anyway?

Noel

I just love how he has a whole website dedicated to showing that Yahweh is wrong and Jebus is right, but in order to look at the evidence you have to first agree with him.

Since I refuse to play his game and deny Yah just to read his page, can you post the portions of his argument you find the most convincing.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline needhelp  
#13 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 5:16:04 AM(UTC)
needhelp
Joined: 5/19/2011(UTC)
Posts: 197
Location: US


My browser didn't block any part of this page. This guy
is a real idiot, don't think he is talking for Yahowah. I couldn't
find any OK button. Here are a couple of paragraphs:

" Many Yahwist who blaspheme the name of Jesus have lied to gain access to this page. They have clicked the OK button confessing faith in and belief in the name of Jesus, then they have written me horrible hate-rant emails showing they lied to gain entry. Not only are Yahwist master deceivers, they are all of them LIARS! That is why I am so adamant against this new breed of Concision antichrist who are trying to deceive Jesus Name people and wreck Jesus name Churches. Everyone who clicks OK to enter this page is required to confess faith in the name of Jesus for salvation to read this study.

My first presentation of a rebuttal against the Concision Yahwist in 1993 was academic but their hate rants (some threatened to kill me), made it important to treat these no longer as innocent deceived people but as apostates who have all intentions of blotting out the name of Jesus from the earth. I will treat these devils and their doctrine (1Timothy 4:1) whose mouths must be stopped, as instructed, and rebuke them before all (Titus 1:11-13). If a man or woman personally attack me I will deal with them separately accordingly depending if they can be saved. If they are already reprobates I will not spend time on firewood for hell. If you have been rebaptized in the name of Yahweh or Yahshua and had the name of Jesus washed off of you, then you are a lost idiot. You can never be saved again. Your stupidity will cost you your soul. The only hope you may have, if there is any mercy, is to come out from that heresy, renounce it, be rebapized, and then begin to fight against that heresy. If you draw back into the perdition of these ungodly men, there is no hope for your soul. You have no hope except to blaspheme the name of Jesus and go on to a devil's hell. If you have lied to get into this page, then you must confess again right here that you beleive in the name of Jesus as the ONLY saving name (Acts 4:12). If you do not, click the back button and get off this page.

This study attacks no man or woman and addresses only some of the issues. If you are a Yahwist (YHWH) and lied to read it, you will become angry at me but also you will have a spirit of judgment and fear come upon your soul revealing that you are damned.

This is not written to convert Yahwist, they are already damned who have recanted and denied the name of Jesus. There is no salvation for them ONLY UTTER reprobation and continued delusions. For those who have stood for Truth, who are subject to a good Apostolic Pastor, and who love the name of Jesus, this study is for you.

I make no apology, the tetragrammaton is a FRAUD! The guess name Yahweh is a Samaritan hoax developed modernly by Genebrardus! The fabricated name Yahshua is a falsehood! I will stand against all Jews and Gentiles, scholars and idiots, who claim otherwise. I am set in defense of the name of Jesus Messieh (Christ). The guess name YAHWEH is a modern FRAUD! It is NOT THE HEBREW NAME OF GOD! It is the name of a demon at least and the name of a false god at most. The fabricated name YAHSHUA is a FRAUD! This fraud is not found in any ancient manuscript of any language. Talk about a made-up name glued to the Messieh, this is the guilty name!

If you deny the name of Jesus, recant that glorious name, then be afraid for your soul will be damned! Most that I have witnessed who have gone into this apostasy have the characteristic of being stubborn and rebellious people. Most have a history of being disloyal to several Pastors. All of them have been trouble makers and have refused to be subject to authority placed in the ministry of a true Man of God (Hebrews 13:17). These roving, church-hopping, disgruntled reprobates, always in some false doctrine, are easy candidates for this heresy. They are those the Scriptures say: DECEIVING AND BEING DECEIVED! This study on the Sacred Name of God is to give glory to the name of Jesus. It is to give the Apostolic Messianic people a view into the truths of God that will attest to the name that is above every name, that at the name of Jesus EVERY knee shall bow and EVERY tongue shall confess.

It is time for all Jesus Name Believers, Pastors, Churches, and Organizations, to stand forth and lift up the name of Jesus. It is time for Apostolic writers to begin exposing the falsehood of the tetragrammaton and all guess names associated with it. "


I only looked at part of the page, about 1/8 . Eating breakfast,
couldn't stomach anymore.

another page of the same
http://www.yahwehism.com/html/yahowah.html




I have forgotten who posted:
http://www.sabbathcovena...sus_is_latin_for_pig.htm

that was an interesting page. There is another one somewhere, can't find it, forget to save it,
says jesus means zeus' horse.
Offline Noel  
#14 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 6:22:00 AM(UTC)
Noel
Joined: 9/27/2009(UTC)
Posts: 92
Location: UK

The following is an example of how he tries to prove a different name.

The only reason I am bothering with this is that I have a friend who is going down this road and I am trying to tell him the truth. Trouble is I don't know much Hebrew and need some help.

Also when I look at the masoretic Hebrew spelling of I AM that I AM it is indeed Aleph Heh Waw Heh rather than Yod Heh Waw Heh.








Starts here::



EHYEH The True Name God Revealed To Moses

What is the true sacred name of God? How does it apply or fit into the name of Jesus? We will look first for the answer in the famous account of the burning bush in Exodus 3:13-14.

"At the burning bush Moses says to God: "When I come to the Israelites and say to them, the God of your fathers has sent me to you, and they ask me, What is His Name?; what shall I say to them?" God answered: "Ehyeh-asher-ehyeh." Thus you shall say to the Israelites, "Ehyeh sent me to you." The three-word name God gives Himself is not easy to translate. The most precise rendering is 'I shall be what I shall be', although it sometimes is translated as 'I am that I am'. The 1962 Jewish Publication Society translation of the Torah despaired of coming up with an accurate rendition, and just left the words in their Hebrew original" (Jewish Literacy, pp. 47-48).

Here is the transliterated version Exodus 3:14 from the Hebrew Bible:

V'yomer Eloyim el-Mosheh eh'yeh asher eh'yeh v'yomer ko tomar livneh Yisrael eh'yeh sh'lachni alechem.

Here is the way it should read in all English Bibles:

"(13). And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say unto me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them?
(14). And God said unto Moses, EHYEH asher EHYEH: and He said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, EHYEH hath sent me unto you"

What name was Moses to use? It was the sacred name "EHYEH."

"Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, EHYEH hath sent me unto you."

Anyone, Jew or Gentile, who claims that the sacred name given to Moses at the burning bush was YHWH, Yahawah, Yahwah, Yahweh, Yihwah, Yahshua, or any other "Yah" name are liars! Anyone who says that Moses went down and said "I AM" sent me are also liars!

The Egyptian word for I AM is "nuk." If Moses went back and told them I AM sent me he would have said "Nuk" sent me. "Nuk" then would have been a name for God. Something not found in your Bible anywhere.

The letters "I AM" do not form a name. I AM was placed in the text and EHYEH removed. In fact, EHYEH has been removed from the text in hundreds if not thousand's of places. I AM is the "perfect present tense" of the name EHYEH. Since when do we replace someone's name with the "tense" of their name when used as a verb?

Many claim that EHYEH and its replacement I AM should be interpreted in a future tense as: "I will be that I will be (J. H. Hertz, The Pentateuch And Haftorahs, p 215); I will be what tomorrow demands (W. Gunther Plaut, The Haftartah Commentary, p. 405); I will be what I want to be (S.R. Hirsh from Plaut, p. 405).

All efforts to make EHYEH mean: "I will be," "He will be," "He who causes to be" or "He shall cause it to come to pass," are all future tense which does not exist in the Hebrew language (see Robert Young's Bible Lexicon, p. 38; Hastings Dictionary of the Bible, Extra Volume, p. 626; and Canon S.R. Driver, Westminister Commentary, Genesis, p. 408).

The point is, that the name EHYEH should have remained in the text and not replace it with I AM to designate the tense or meaing of that sacred name.

Ancient Paleo-Hebrew is not a sacred or holy language.

The claim that ancient Hebrew is a sacred and holy language is false. Every doctrine built upon that false premise is false. The idea or claim that a name for God spoken in Hebrew makes that name holy because it was spoken in Hebrew is false. Anyone who claims then that God's name(s) must be spoken in Hebrew for it/them to be acceptable, is making a false statement.

The objection that the Israelites did not speak Egyptian but the sacred language of Paleo-Hebrew is not true. Paleo-Hebrew is a homogenized language consisting of several other language phonetics and meanings. The Israelites did not adopt the Paleo-Phoenician language until many centuries after leaving Egypt, sometime between 1100-900BC.

Before there was a written language, words and names were usually monosyllable. By adding one monosyllable to another compound word forms were created. Transferring these ideas and word sounds into a written form was the beginning of a pictorial writing system. These glyphs or images whether they were the wedge type strokes found in the cunniform style or the figures found in the Egyptian language, stood for pronunciation of word forms. As this relates to the sacred names of God, there is absolutly no way with perfect certainty, that we can say how God's names were anciently pronounced. At the dispersion of the nations at the tower of Babel, and the instant creation by God of multiple languages, there had to come into existence at the same time different words to describe the same God. The idea that there exist one single pronunciation for the name(s) of God is just absolutely false. The idea that the name(s) of God must be spoken in the Paleo-Hebrew or in the Babylonian Aramaic tongue, for it (or them) to be holy and sacred is also false.

The original language of Adam was different than the Ugaritic language of Abraham. The Ugaritic language of Abraham was different than the Egyptian language of Moses and the Israelites in Egypt. The Phoenician language adopted by the Israelites 600 years after they came into the promised land is not the language of Adam, Abraham, or that of Moses. And finally, although there is a great affinity of Paleo-Hebrew to Aramaic, these are different languages.

God spoke in each language and in each one described himself by names and titles. We have no proof or evidence that God insisted upon one continious pronounciation for his names or titles and these names and titles were the same in all languages. If the evidence of such a fact of proof is missing, how can any man claim something to which God gave or left no testimony? Either the claim is false on the face of the assertion, or it is false because a claim so important if it were true, would have an abundance of testimony, and none exist!

At the tower of Babel, nine men could point toward heaven at the same time. One would utter "El"; another would utter "Neter"; another would utter "Theos"; another would utter "Deus"; another would say "Adonai"; another would say "Neb"; another would say "Moryo"; another would say "Kurios"; and yet another say "Dominus." All were speaking of the same being, ...the same God, the same LORD. It is when these names and titles are stolen by the profane and used to designate their gods that these carry a stigma of rebuke and shame.

In the chart below, it can be seen that many Phoenician words descend from both Egyptian and Proto-Canaanite. Hebrew as a separate sacred language back to Adam is a myth. The entire Kabbalistic scheme of mysticism based upon Hebrew letters and associated gematria is a clever fraud. Hebrew as a language spoken by the Israelites in Egypt is a myth. Hebrew is not a "pure" language that came from God to the Jews. Ancient Paleo-Hebrew is nothing but the Phoenician language with roots of Egyptian, Ugaritic, and Proto-Canaanite words and phonetics.

You will learn shortly that "Yah" was an Egyptian moon god. Why would God tell Moses to tell the Israelites the moon god sent him? God did not give or speak the tetragrammaton at the burning bush. Anyone who claims that the sacred name is "YHVH" or "YHWH" in this text and then make this into "Yahweh," "Yahuweh," "Yahshua," or "Jehovah" are liars. They may be educated liars, ignorant liars, or stupid liars, but still liars. I am making this bold and straight-forward statement because the Yahwist and their lying demonic false prophets have purposely perverted the Word of God to insert their guess names for the purpose of later recanting and denying that the name of "Jesus" is a valid and correct name in the English language of the Saviour. If you love and believe in the name of Jesus you will not find my remarks offensive, but if you deny the name of Jesus and you are reading this, you are a liar anyway for clicking ok to come here where you are not welcome. The information on this page is for those who love the name of Jesus. If you are reading this and you lied to get in here, then take a warning. What you are about to read as you sit there a confessed liar will show you, you have damned your soul. You cannot be saved. It would be better for you to click and get out of here.

What is the sacred name revealed to Moses at the burning bush? It is EHYEH! And what name was Moses supposed to pronounce when he told the Israelites the name of the God who sent him was EHYEH, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob? And what is then God's memorial name of deliverance from Egyptian bondage? It is EHYEH!

(15). And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, The Lord (Adonai) God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this (or "EHYEH") is my name forever, and this is my memorial unto all generations. (KJV EXO 3:13-15 with Hebrew emphasis).

God himself spoke three name-words to describe himself: God or Elohim; Lord God or ADONAI Elohim, and Ehyeh. God NEVER gave to Moses the tetragrammaton here or anywhere else in the Bible.

Any effort to change the word ADONAI/LORD in this text to "YHVH or YHWH" and then insert either "Yahweh, Yahshua, or Jehovah" is false. You are a pervert if you do it and you will go to hell for adding unto the word of God:

"Ye shall not add unto the word which I commanded you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of ADONAI your Elohim (the LORD your God) which I commanded you" (Deut. 4:2).

The words "LORD GOD" here in their original Hebrew is "ADONAI Elohim." This "Adonai Elohim" was the name or titles by which God was address prior to Moses. Any effort to corrupt "Adonai" and make it into the tetragrammaton YHVH or YHWH is false. It is done falsely so that they may deny that the name EHYEH which God sent Moses down into Egypt with, is altered into "YAHWEH, YAHSHUA, or JEHOVAH." This is a sin and a grevious distortion of the Word of God! ADONAI in all caps signifies God as LORD and in the translation LORD is all CAPS because ADONAI was all CAPS for distinction! When a person calls God LORD or ADONAI they are saying: 1.) There is none greater; 2.) There is no greater Sovereign; 3.) He alone has power over the supplicant; 4.) and the person is confessing full and total obedience and honor! To take ADONAI and translate this as LORD and then pervert LORD into YHWH and then into the guess name Yahweh, is falsehood!

What did God call himself at the burning bush? He said "EHYEH asher EHYEH." This is said to mean "I AM that I AM. Why? Because in the Hebrew there is to future tense there is only past and present. To make EHYEH asher EHYEH to mean "I will be what I will be" is a futuristic statement and is false. We do not know what EHYEH asher EHYEH means other than how it is incorporated into the name of Jesus. And in that name it means "God is salvation or God has become salvation" (both present tense).

If you are a believer in the fraud interpolated into the text above that the name of God is YHVH or YHWH and make these to mean "Yahweh, Yahshua, or Jehovah" then read no further. You are unworthy of what follows. If you have already recanted the name of Jesus and claim it comes from Zeus and or Latin and means pig-god, THEN GET OFF THIS PAGE. GET OUT OF HERE! YOU ARE NOT WANTED! REPROBATES ARE NOT MINISTERED TO HERE! I say this because Yahweh blasphemers have sent me all sorts of hateful, degrading, and blasphemous emails. I have had to revise this study to rebuke these reprobate gainsayers. And I do not feel the slight bit of remorse in rebuking them!

For those who love the name of Jesus Christ you may continue this study. The sacred name given to Moses at the burning bush was EHYEH asher EHYEH. Read now and be blessed.


End of quote.



Any ideas of how I should proceed?

Noel









Offline FredSnell  
#15 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 6:32:34 AM(UTC)
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^
Thanks!
"If you have lied to get into this page, then you must confess again right here that you beleive in the name of Jesus as the ONLY saving name (Acts 4:12). If you do not, click the back button and get off this page."

This is his game. Surely he is not a born again christian, more likely born into christianity. And again, no diferent than anyone born into, Mormonism, Hinduism, Islam, Judaism, Christianity, Confucianism, Buddhism, Taoism, Secular Humanism.
Most will not consider what He has shown most of us. All of them will not step back for a different perspective, and thus never awaken.
They will not debate, but put up an e-mail like you exposed in the 2nd link and list it as how these people that do confess that God has a good and proper name, and stand on it, must be crazy, but yet you must follow his doctrine before you can even
read what he claims to expose.
I'm reading, Bart Ehrmans book, "Forged." He making a fine point that so much of the NT is not what is purports to be, that then, maybe I shouldn't, and really haven't trusted much of it for a while.
Offline James  
#16 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 7:50:46 AM(UTC)
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Quote:
Here is the transliterated version Exodus 3:14 from the Hebrew Bible:

V'yomer Eloyim el-Mosheh eh'yeh asher eh'yeh v'yomer ko tomar livneh Yisrael eh'yeh sh'lachni alechem.

Here is the way it should read in all English Bibles:

"(13). And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say unto me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them?
(14). And God said unto Moses, EHYEH asher EHYEH: and He said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, EHYEH hath sent me unto you"

What name was Moses to use? It was the sacred name "EHYEH."

"Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, EHYEH hath sent me unto you."

Anyone, Jew or Gentile, who claims that the sacred name given to Moses at the burning bush was YHWH, Yahawah, Yahwah, Yahweh, Yihwah, Yahshua, or any other "Yah" name are liars! Anyone who says that Moses went down and said "I AM" sent me are also liars!


I always love when someone makes a claim that is demonstrably untrue, and doesn't back it up. Yes He did say to Moshe to say to them that I Am sent me, but if the ignorant fool who wrote this had bothered to continue reading, just one verse more, as opposed to taking these two verses out of context he would have read where God said to Moshe to say unto the children of Israel that YHWH the God of your fathers... So why does he quote 13 and 14, but ignore verse 15? Answer because he has an agenda and he hates Yahowah (not a guess he outright states this).

So that you know verse 15 attest to God telling Moshe to tell the people that Yod Hey Waw Hey sent, you can look it up in a modern Hebrew bible, I uses the Anderson Forbes, or if you have access it is also clearly written in 4Q13 Exodus B.

After reading that I don't feel the need to waste time reading anything else this agenda driven ignoranus has written.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline FredSnell  
#17 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 7:56:12 AM(UTC)
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Noel, yadas writing on the subject should be enough to make him seek at his level. And as far as that so called pastor that doesn't mind tell ppl like me, off, I have one question for him. If he can read the last book by Gods prophet, Malachi, and tell me that YHWH is returning in His fullness b/c christianity has won the world, or b/c christians along with the rest of religion, has destroyed it instead.

1.Christianity: 2.1 billion...WINNER!!!!!

2.Islam: 1.5 billion...2nd place, until the bombs go off!!!

3.Secular/Nonreligious/Agnostic/Atheist: 1.1 billion

4.Hinduism: 900 million

5.Chinese traditional religion: 394 million

6.Buddhism: 376 million

7.primal-indigenous: 300 million

8.African Traditional & Diasporic: 100 million

9.Sikhism: 23 million

10.Juche: 19 million

11.Spiritism: 15 million

12.Judaism: 14 million

13.Baha'i: 7 million

14.Jainism: 4.2 million

15.Shinto: 4 million

16.Cao Dai: 4 million

17.Zoroastrianism: 2.6 million

18.Tenrikyo: 2 million

19.Neo-Paganism: 1 million

20.Unitarian-Universalism: 800 thousand

21.Rastafarianism: 600 thousand

22.Scientology: 500 thousand


Offline James  
#18 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 7:57:13 AM(UTC)
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Quote:
(15). And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, The Lord (Adonai) God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this (or "EHYEH") is my name forever, and this is my memorial unto all generations. (KJV EXO 3:13-15 with Hebrew emphasis).

God himself spoke three name-words to describe himself: God or Elohim; Lord God or ADONAI Elohim, and Ehyeh. God NEVER gave to Moses the tetragrammaton here or anywhere else in the Bible.

Any effort to change the word ADONAI/LORD in this text to "YHWH or YHWH" and then insert either "Yahweh, Yahshua, or Jehovah" is false. You are a pervert if you do it and you will go to hell for adding unto the word of God:


Okay the masochist in made me read on where this fool completely lies. All the evidence is clear that Adonai was not written in verse 15. I love how he uses Hebrew sources when it fits him and then ignores them when it doesn't. The KJV put in LORD, but adonai is not written in the Hebrew text, and this isn't even a case where the Masoreates replaced, even in the masoretic YHWH is written, but more damning than that in the oldest known copy, 4Q13 Exodus B, YHWH is written. So what he is saying is not only untrue it is the inverse of the Truth. Yahowah was corrupted to Adonai, all the evidence clearly shows this.

I am now balder because I have pulled out large chunks of hair in frustration of reading this crap.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline James  
#19 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 8:00:34 AM(UTC)
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Noel wrote:

Any ideas of how I should proceed?


Show him the evidence that shows this guy is an ignorant fool. Show him the Hebrew of 3:15, show him the Hebrew of the DSS if you have access. Point out that Yahowah appears hundreds of times in the DSS, and that on seventy some occasions it can be proved 100% that the oldest text had Yahowah and not Adonai, and that man replaced.

The evidence is clear if one looks at it, and not some man's corruption of it.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline James  
#20 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 8:30:42 AM(UTC)
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Should you be interested here is the text of Exodus 3:15

Lexham Hebrew English Interlinear
Quote:
וַיֹּאמֶר עוֹד אֱלֹהִים אֶל־מֹשֶׁה כֹּה־תֹאמַר אֶל־בְּנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל יהוה אֱלֹהֵי אֲבֹתֵיכֶם אֱלֹהֵי אַבְרָהָם אֱלֹהֵי יִצְחָק וֵאלֹהֵי יַעֲקֹב שְׁלָחַנִי אֲלֵיכֶם זֶה־שְּׁמִי לְעֹלָם וְזֶה זִכְרִי לְדֹר דֹּר׃


Anderson Forbes Hebrew Bible
Quote:
וַיֹּאמֶר עוֹד אֱלֹהִים אֶל־מֹשֶׁה כֹּה־תֹאמַר אֶל־בְּנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל יהוה אֱלֹהֵי אֲבֹתֵיכֶם אֱלֹהֵי אַבְרָהָם אֱלֹהֵי יִצְחָק וֵאלֹהֵי יַעֲקֹב שְׁלָחַנִי אֲלֵיכֶם זֶה־שְּׁמִי לְעֹלָם וְזֶה זִכְרִי לְדֹר דֹּר׃


4Q13 Exodus
Quote:
[ויואמר אלוהים עוד אל מושה כה תואמר אל בני ישראל יהוה אל[והי
[אברהם אלוהי ישחק ואלוהי יעקוב שלחני אליכם זה שמֿי֯ ל֯[עולם


The Bold and Underline on Yahowah are added by me to make them easier to spot. If you need I can give you a screen capture from Logos showing these that way I am not accused of making them up. I simply copied and pasted them here from Logos, using the sources I attributed them to.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

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Offline James  
#21 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 8:34:59 AM(UTC)
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So that everyone know, adonai is written in Hebrew: אָדוֹן Very different from Yahowah's name.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline James  
#22 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 8:48:54 AM(UTC)
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Noel, another thing to point out to your friend is the fact that in the oldest manuscripts the name Jesus does not appear once, neither does Iseus or any other form that people claim as the basis of Jesus. The fact that Iseus was not used is extremely telling. Why would they use a placeholder for His name and not uses Iseus if that was the Greek equivalent of His name? His disciples, His brother, and everyone who lived with in about 300 years of Him, choose not to use the Greek Iseus, but instead to use a placeholder. Why? The most logical answer, Occam's razor, is that His name could not be transliterated into Greek (Greek does not posses the sounds) therefore rather than butcher his name as rendering Iseus would do, or to be even more accurate the best attempt to transliterate His name would not be Iseus since the us ending was added to fit Greek gender rules there being no s on the end of Yahowsha, or Yahuwshua. So rather than butcher His name, something christians would later have no issue with doing, they choose to use placeholders instead.

So Jesus is nowhere to be found anywhere near Scripture, and is a horrible transliteration of a horrible transliteration at best, and Yahowah is found thousands of times in Scripture. So which should we go with?
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

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Offline James  
#23 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 9:02:50 AM(UTC)
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In response to http://www.yahwehism.com/html/yahowah.html

I would point out a few simple truths. One as I have said above, Isues does not appear in any of the oldest manuscripts, it simply is not there, to act as though it were is irrational, and to state that it were is ignorant. We should not base anything on that which is irrational or ignorant.

Two, to argue that because the Septuagint translated Yahuwshua as Iesous means that Jesus is His name is such flawed logic. If they are all the same then why do our translations give us one as Joshua and one as Jesus, for consistencies sake should we not use one. Iesous may in fact be the best transliteration of Yahushua into Greek. But the fact remains we are not speaking Greek, and the rule is to transliterate names into the new language, not transliterate transliterations into the new language. In that regard Joshua while much much more accurate than Jesus would still not be correct since the English language is fully capable of accurately transliterating that name, is it Yahuwshua.

Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline James  
#24 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 9:08:10 AM(UTC)
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http://www.sabbathcovena...sus_is_latin_for_pig.htm

Probably not true, but I don't know. I wouldn't stake my argument on this anymore than I would on the relationship between Zeus and Jesus. While there may be validity, it's not a strong enough point and there are much stronger ones. I find it best to leave out the weakest points as they will be the ones attacked causing your stronger ones to be ignored. SO I try to use only the strongest points. The Strongest points in this case I would say are the ones that I have already shown, combined with section of ITG which shows why the transliteration Yahowah is the most likely.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline needhelp  
#25 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 10:12:13 AM(UTC)
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Thanks James, sorry about your hair, I feel much better now.
Offline shalom82  
#26 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 10:21:06 AM(UTC)
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How about the mass undertaking of not only changing the name of God but also everything that contains the partial name YH or YHW? Think of all of the names of the the Israeli populace....the prophets and kings and functional words. And I would also add non scriptual evidence that confirms

Taken from "Bible Review" February 2004.

Prof. Jeffery H. Tigay. University of Pennsylvania.

Copyright 2004 - Biblical Archaeology Society.

# [see footnote]

Quote:
"One tool commonly used to measure Israel's polytheism is onomastics the study of names. Both biblical and extrabiblical Israelite names are known to incorporate the names of gods often YHWH (Yahweh), the name of the Israelite deity, but also the names of foreign gods. These names are called theophoric names, from the Greek for 'bearing a god'..

"There may of originally been more biblical names mentioning foreign gods that have now been expurgated. If so, this could be further evidence of Israelite polytheism that we have lost.

One way to check whether this occurred is to study the Israelite names preserved not in the Bible but in inscriptions from the biblical period, since these have not been tampered with by later scribes.. I collected all the Israelite personal names from the biblical period known from inscriptions up to that time. I expected to find numerous examples of pagan personal names � the kinds of names I suspected had been expunged from the Bible by scribal revisions.. The results surprised me.. 94% were Yahwistic and only 6% mentioned other deities.

The inscriptional statistics are almost the same as in the case of biblical theophoric names, where Yahwistic names predominate by 91% to 9%. The similarity of these ratios suggests that editorial censorship in the Masoretic Text do not significantly distort the picture..

"All this shows that personal names reflect only one facet of the religious life of a particular society. Although they constitute an important piece of evidence, they do not of themselves solve the question of how many Israelites worshiped other gods.. They must be combined with evidence from other types of inscriptions: Hebrew letters, votive inscriptions, oath formulas, religious graffiti, references to Israelite temples, temple vessels and cultic personnel and Hebrew amulets. This evidence, which I have surveyed elsewhere is mostly though not exclusively Yahwistic, presenting a picture essentially similar to that presented by the personal names ..."


I honestly don't know what the guy gets out of this ridiculous exercise...but it is so flawed and unscrupulous in presentation that I can't give it one more second of consideration. I understand fully that people have different levels of understanding and we all have to work out these issues and I also understand even the most mature in the covenant are always growing and our understanding is always evolving and we may tweek here or there but as for me....when I see something as stubbornly and faithfully ludicrous as this.....it actually makes me physically ill.
YHWH's ordinances are true, and righteous altogether.
Offline FredSnell  
#27 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 10:21:19 AM(UTC)
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^
^
lol..he has enough to make you and I a couple of wigs with more to spare..and thanks to for killing it with logic, J.


http://anintroductiontog...me_2-Shem-His_Name.Torah

bottom of (pg54) and continue from there.
Offline Noel  
#28 Posted : Monday, August 27, 2012 10:41:34 PM(UTC)
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Hello everybody

I would just like to say thank you to everyone who has contributed to solving my problem. Particulary James who has invested some time in it even though he really didn't want to, and for very understandable reasons.

I have never doubted the name myself, but as I explained before a good friend of mine was using info on that site to undermine me.

Pastor Cohen G Reckart is the person behind this. He runs a church called Jesus Messieh Fellowship International and is a Bishop in it He has a Doctorate and a PhD in Theology and speaks Hebrew etc.etc.etc.

You can get one of his degrees by applying. You don't have to do any work other than to have been a 'Oneness' Apostolic Pastor for over 20 years. His degree will cost $1,250 but that does not include the travelling expenses and hotel costs for him to come and bestow it on you.

However for those who have not bothered about his silly manipulative game of clicking certain beliefs in before you get on the site and gone in there, you have to hand it to him that it is researched in tremendous detail and therefore far more difficult to convince someone who is into it that it is wrong when you don't have the tools to do it,, like me.

Thanks everybody.

Noel
Offline James  
#29 Posted : Tuesday, August 28, 2012 3:10:12 AM(UTC)
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Noel wrote:

However for those who have not bothered about his silly manipulative game of clicking certain beliefs in before you get on the site and gone in there, you have to hand it to him that it is researched in tremendous detail and therefore far more difficult to convince someone who is into it that it is wrong when you don't have the tools to do it,, like me.


The tremendous amount of research and detail, when it suits him, is the most condemning thing. There is so much that he would have had to have come across in this research and ignore to hold his conclusion that their can be no doubt that this man knows he is wrong and is lying to make a buck. The most glaring example is using the Hebrew in Exodus 3:13 and 14, but using only an English translation in 15, or more accurately translating back to Hebrew from a miss-translated English version to insert Adonai where even the Masoreats didn't insert it.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
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