 Joined: 7/5/2007(UTC) Posts: 544  Thanks: 4 times
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I’ve been considering the question of free-willed choice as it applies to Yahweh hardening hearts. The classic passages are the plagues upon Egypt and Pharoah’s resistance to letting the Israelites go. I wonder if the common translations have it right or whether if what occurred might more accurately be described as Yahweh permitted Pharaoh’s heart to remain hardened despite the first nine plagues? I see conflicting factors at work in this incident. Yahweh valuing free-willed choice to include Pharaoh’s, as well as, Yah’s interest in seeing His Covenant promises fulfilled; specifically seeing His people freed from Egyptian captivity and set apart to Himself. Later the covenant promise to culminate with the atonement of Yahshua in the promised land, among a people set apart to Yahweh. I went to see if this topic came up in the forum or in Ken or Yada’s writing. The one passage I found was from chapter 15 of Ken’s Future History: Quote:“Surely the princes of Zoan are fools; Pharaoh’s wise counselors give foolish counsel. How do you say to Pharaoh, ‘I am the son of the wise, the son of ancient kings?’ Where are they? Where are your wise men? Let them tell you now, and let them know what Yahweh, Lord of hosts, has purposed against Egypt. The princes of Zoan have become fools; the princes of Noph are deceived; They have also deluded Egypt, those who are the mainstay of its tribes. Yahweh has mingled a perverse spirit in her midst; and they have caused Egypt to err in all her work, as a drunken man staggers in his vomit.” (Isaiah 19:11-14)
Here, as in so many cases in scripture, we see Yahweh “hardening the heart” of the Egyptians. It bears repeating that Yahweh’s blinding of the eyes of sinners to the truth (or as it’s put here, mingling “a perverse spirit in her midst”) is always in response to a previous rejection of his Word. God will never force anyone to change his mind; but He will occasionally petrify a previously held attitude, effectively closing his enemy’s mind on the subject. So is it the case that Yahweh hardens the hearts or blinded eyes to Truth only in a manner which conforms with their own chosen free-willed decisions regarding Him at times when He is overtly acting in their midst? Maybe maintaining a balance of choice? I hope that I’m making sense and would appreciate your thoughts.
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 Joined: 10/3/2007(UTC) Posts: 1,191 Location: São Paulo, Brazil Was thanked: 3 time(s) in 2 post(s)
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While I'm not really sure how to answer the question KP did cover Moses and Pharaoh quite a bit in chapter 2, Holy God Holy People, of TOM II. You can find it from mitzvah #664 to #669. http://theownersmanual.n...Torah?usterms=664#searchHere's one quote from mitzvah #666: But Yahweh flatly told Moses that His words would not be heeded, and that He would “harden Pharaoh’s heart” because of his rebellious pride.
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Joined: 7/5/2007(UTC) Posts: 544 Thanks: 4 times
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Thanks for the tip Matthew. I thought there was another mention on the topic somewhere among the various books but thought possibly Yada covered it somewhere in YY.
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 Joined: 6/28/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,030
Location: Palmyra, VA
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I recall writing somewhere that Yahweh never closes the door on honest searchers, but sometimes he locks doors we have previously slammed in his face, or words to that effect. We are only "predestined" to reap the crop we ourselves have chosen to sow in this field we call human existence. Yahweh doesn't choose our destiny---we do.
kp
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 Joined: 10/29/2008(UTC)
Posts: 370
Location: Philadelphia
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Quote:I’ve been considering the question of free-willed choice as it applies to Yahweh hardening hearts. The classic passages are the plagues upon Egypt and Pharoah’s resistance to letting the Israelites go Lots of people get angry at God. Getting 'smote' with nearly a dozen plagues would tend to harden anyone's heart, especially if their 'day job' was playing the role of a pagan deity. I think that Pharaoh still had the ability to choose, but he was very unlikely to exercise that option. |
"You shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free." But first, it will piss you off! |
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Joined: 7/5/2007(UTC) Posts: 544 Thanks: 4 times
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edStueart wrote:Lots of people get angry at God.
Getting 'smote' with nearly a dozen plagues would tend to harden anyone's heart, especially if their 'day job' was playing the role of a pagan deity.
I think that Pharaoh still had the ability to choose, but he was very unlikely to exercise that option. I think there is much truth in what you're saying Ed. I'm just unclear to what degree did Pharaoh harden his own heart to retain his lofty position and to what degree if any Yah had in hardening Pharaoh's heart to endure the plagues Yah was using for His end purpose and ultimately for our benefit? If the common rendering is correct and Yah did indeed use His influence towards Pharaoh resisting Moses/Yah's demand then what would've been the result had Yah NOT hardened Pharaoh's heart? Does Pharaoh let the Israelites go into the wilderness to serve Yah earlier into the schedule of plagues and then what? The Israelites leave into the desert without witnessing more supernatural signs from Yah? Would there have been no Passover or at least a different one? Maybe the Israelites have greater doubt when the tests in the wilderness came or the Canaanites have greater doubt of Yah's authority, "after all He delivered the Israelites from mighty Egypt with only a plague of frogs and some reddish water"? I hope you see where I'm approaching this question from? Does Yah act in such a way as to retain a balance of evidence for Him and to trust Him as well as retaining a plausible option for rejecting or mistrusting Him? If He does, is He willing to use a bit of "heart hardening" when His purposes require a direct / supernatural approach to accomplish His purposes while preserving free-will for all? KP mentioned that some Egyptians having witnessed Yah's power first hand not only gave of their household treasures upon the Israelites departure but even joined the Israelites in their exodus. Do you suppose any Israelites decided to stay?
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Joined: 10/29/2008(UTC)
Posts: 370
Location: Philadelphia
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Theophilus wrote: I'm just unclear to what degree did Pharaoh harden his own heart to retain his lofty position and to what degree if any Yah had in hardening Pharaoh's heart to endure the plagues Yah was using for His end purpose and ultimately for our benefit?
Perhaps the plagues where the instrument of "hardening" that YHWH decided to use? |
"You shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free." But first, it will piss you off! |
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