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Offline Big Rich  
#1 Posted : Monday, September 29, 2008 8:13:15 PM(UTC)
Big Rich
Joined: 9/2/2008(UTC)
Posts: 62
Location: Indiana

Hello, I'd like to ask you all for some help.
Just yesterday this http://media.www.ndsmcob...ts.College-3457538.shtml was written in our school newspaper. Doubtless you can guess how this made me feel. I want to write in a letter to the editor about it, but it's not going quite as well as I'd hoped. Here's what I have so far...

Quote:
Before I start, I’d like to note a few things.
All scripture used is from the New International Version, as presented at BibleGateway.com. The only alteration I have made is to restore the name of the God of Israel and the inspiration for the words of this book, Yahweh, to its rightful place as it was written in the original Hebrew. This is because, “God also said to Moses, "Say to the Israelites, Yahweh, the God of your fathers—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob—has sent me to you.' This is my name forever, the name by which I am to be remembered from generation to generation.” (Ex. 3:15) How can I argue with that?
I understand from the get go that I’m probably not going to change too many minds with this viewpoint. However, Yahweh has told us, “so is my word that goes out from my mouth: It will not return to me empty, but will accomplish what I desire and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.”(Isaiah 55:11) I am up against the traditions and the instructions of your fathers, yet I am to, “Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction.” (2 Timothy 4:2) Notre Dame is, if I may say so, definitely out of season for the point I will try to make. I don’t want you to take my word for anything. You don’t have trust my interpretations of scripture: this is your right. You will not be judged on whether you trusted me but on whether you trusted Yahweh and His Messiah and the words which they have given to us. “For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.” (Hebrews 4:12)
If you followed me through all that buildup, which I really doubt many people did, you’re probably wondering what in the world this is all about. What it is about is that I must strongly protest the article “Century-old statue protects College” that ran in the September 29 issue of the Observer. I will do so by detailing the ways in which this article ascribes protective powers to a statue, protective powers that rightfully only rest with Yahweh (and possibly the fire department) and responding with scripture’s instructions against such things.
As the article states, “After the fire, a statue was promised to St. Michael with all of the buildings placed under his care[…]” ”You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below.” (Ex 20:4) Yes, the “form of anything in heaven above” does include Michael. “Do not turn away after useless idols. They can do you no good, nor can they rescue you, because they are useless.”(1 Samuel 12:21) Michael may not be useless, but he reports to Yahweh and acts as He commands. Why then would you seek to gain the archangel’s favor by going against the dictates of his Master? For that matter, why seek Michael’s favor at all? His Master, Yahweh Almighty, is hardly stingy with His. “Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened.” (Matthew 7:7-8)
“The Great Archangel is one of St. Mary’s special patrons and his protection is invoked against fire and pestilence.” “Like a scarecrow in a melon patch, their idols cannot speak; they must be carried because they cannot walk. Do not fear them; they can do no harm nor can they do any good." (Jeremiah 10:5) “Gather together and come; assemble, you fugitives from the nations. Ignorant are those who carry about idols of wood, who pray to gods that cannot save.”(Isaiah 45:20) Statues cannot save, regardless of who they depict, as Exodus 32:7-8 shows us. “And Yahweh struck the people with a plague because of what they did with the calf Aaron had made.”(Ex. 32:35)
“To whom, then, will you compare God? What image will you compare him to?” (Isaiah 14:18) Well, this one apparently. Before you say it, yes I am fully aware of the meaning of the name “Michael,” However, putting “Who is like unto God” on a stone statue, one which apparently is being relied upon for protection against fire, is just not right. Who is REALLY like unto God? “No one is like you, O Yahweh; you are great, and your name is mighty in power.”(Jeremiah 10:4-6) Thank you Jeremiah, I couldn’t have said it better.
“Each occasion serves to prove that St. Michael watches over the sisters and students of St. Mary’s and continues to protect them from fire incidents, according to the document”
“Then Yahweh said to Moses, "Go down, because your people, whom you brought up out of Egypt, have become corrupt. 8 They have been quick to turn away from what I commanded them and have made themselves an idol cast in the shape of a calf. They have bowed down to it and sacrificed to it and have said, 'These are your gods, O Israel, who brought you up out of Egypt.'” (Ex: 32:7-8) Neither the statue nor Michael himself protects St. Mary’s from fire. In fact, all the near-misses shown in the documents are enough to make you wonder if ANYONE is.

“’It’s a very impressive statue,’ said Saint Mary’s Archive Director John Kovach.” Is it an impressive statue? Maybe, but that’s all it is.


I'm still somewhat wary of someone pulling the old, "But we don't pray to the STATUE," and I also am somewhat perturbed that I can't actually attack the character of the object of devotion, since Michael is one of Yah's angels. Plus, despite the ridiculousness of this article, I don't think people really pray to/in front of it much. I also still need to toss in the angel from Revelation telling John not to worship him somewhere. Any other advice? I really want to portray God's message about this type of stuff as clearly and truely as possible. Please feel free to criticize anything I've gotten wrong.

Happy Yom Taruw'ah!
Offline bitnet  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, September 30, 2008 12:37:16 AM(UTC)
bitnet
Joined: 7/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,120

Shalom,

Been there, done that, regretted it, repented. I'd vouch for Big Rich's reply as the reasoning is clear and inspired... go ahead and send it. Many Hindus also do not pray to their statues... but to the gods and deities they represent. So do many Buddhists and other animists. But they still make these offerings by way of these statues, in direct opposition to Yahweh's command, just like the ancient Yisraelites used the golden calf in worship of their elohim. Remembering their fate and the ground-up statue smoothie... I don't think anyone who truly understands this particular commandment would want to have these statues anywhere near themselves.
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline Big Rich  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, September 30, 2008 8:32:11 PM(UTC)
Big Rich
Joined: 9/2/2008(UTC)
Posts: 62
Location: Indiana

Thank you for vouching for me. I just wish I could get some support for my views on the home front. I'm still kind of debating sending it in, seeing as everyone I've told about the idea here at ND has been unanimously negative about it. I still stand behind everything I said, but if my points are just going to get hand-waved off and ignored like has happened with all my test cases here, I don't know if I should try it. I'm considering writing in about the Name and why the Vatican's ban on it is so bad, and I don't want to alienate any potential audience for that piece with this one.

I ran it by a couple people in my dorm when I wrote it and it really didn't seem to accomplish anything. For everybody (aside from you of course :) ) that I told about this article I got responces ranging in tone from "You're an idiot for writing this" to the much more generous, "People are going to write in and make you look like an idiot for writing this." If my target audience is just going to shut out what I'm trying to say and ignore my evidence, I don't know what the point is.

Plus I had the awesome privledge of this conversation with my roommate: (dialog heavily paraphrased)
[I mention scripture against idolatry]
Roommate: "You aren't supposed to take that stuff literally"
Me, shocked: "What? How do you take "don't commit idolatry" in anyway OTHER than literally? What's the spiritual/metaphorical interpretation of that?"
Roommate:"You aren't supposed to take scripture literally. It was written by men and just inspired by God."

I also got asked if I was Jewish after I said the name "Yahweh" (probably the high point and most hilarious moment of the night, given their strong aversion to the Name) and told a story about how some college professor challenged God to knock him down in the next 15 minutes and how some other guy walked up in 13 and knocked him down. I guess it was an interesting story, but not quite topical. Furthermore I got accused of "starting my own religion." Fun stuff...
Offline Matthew  
#4 Posted : Wednesday, October 1, 2008 1:12:51 AM(UTC)
Matthew
Joined: 10/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,191
Man
Location: São Paulo, Brazil

Was thanked: 3 time(s) in 2 post(s)
Big Rich wrote:
Thank you for vouching for me. I just wish I could get some support for my Furthermore I got accused of "starting my own religion." Fun stuff...

I know what you mean! My wife calls my religion "Mattism" and keeps warning me I mustn't offend her family and that I shouldn't tell them they're wrong by following Judaism and Catholicism.

Your letter is well written Big Rich, I think you should send it. You're doing your part by exposing lies and idolatry. If they wave it off then it's on their hands. Plus this is great way for you to grow even more bold in doing the work and growing in your relationship with Yahweh. What's that saying? Oh yes, What Would Jesus Do?! Or as Yada, or was it KP, said "What Did Yahushua Do?!"
Offline Robskiwarrior  
#5 Posted : Wednesday, October 1, 2008 2:48:02 AM(UTC)
Robskiwarrior
Joined: 7/4/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,470
Man
Location: England

Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
I feel your frustration Rich.

I even made a comment on a video that saw on You Tube - someone said that Allah means "god" in Arabic and I explained that it was actually Illah that means god and Allah was a name. With no mention of my believes or anything, just trying to instil a truth, you know. And I got the reply "you are wrong, all the Christians in Arabic speaking areas say Allah means god" blar blar blar...

I am getting to the stage where im thinking, is there even any point in giving out truth, If people are just going to hold on to the lies anyway. Its frustrating.

As for your letter, I don’t know - will it fall on deaf ears? Probably. I think you handled the issues well, and the scripture speaks for itself... I doubt you would get a huge response though.
Signature Updated! Woo that was old...
Offline Big Rich  
#6 Posted : Wednesday, October 1, 2008 1:05:38 PM(UTC)
Big Rich
Joined: 9/2/2008(UTC)
Posts: 62
Location: Indiana

Thank you guys for your support. It's good to be able to remember that I'm not alone in these convictions. I almost wonder sometimes when I talk to people here about theological issues if we're speaking the same language, and it's comforting to know I haven't just gone off the deep end.

I used to think that all I'd have to do was just present the truth to people and, since it's the truth, they'd just toss all their lies aside and come with me. I guess that was a bit, okay, a lot simplistic of a view to hold, but it's what I used to think things worked like. It's just extremely weird for me to discover that people have almost their own isolated realities where they, by their own feelings and what they've been taught, determine their own "truth". I've always been semi-open to new ideas and to being persuaded with the truth and I just assumed that everyone else was the same way.

Maybe it's because I really didn't have anything invested in religion like some of these other people do that I was able to change. Maybe I just got "lucky" ie: chosen. I don't know. I just wish that the people I've been leanign on were a bit more open.
Offline In His Name  
#7 Posted : Wednesday, October 1, 2008 8:01:25 PM(UTC)
In His Name
Joined: 9/7/2008(UTC)
Posts: 550

Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
Don't despair Rich, even Yahushua had to kick the dust off his sandles on occasion. All we can do is scatter the seeds of Truth, whether they grow or not depends on the soil.
“Because he clings to Me, is joined to Me, loves and delights in Me, desires Me, therefore I will deliver him, carry him safely away, cause him to escape from harm making him inaccessible and strong, and delivering him safely to heaven, because he has known, observed, cared for, recognized, instructed and advised others to use, designated, acknowledged, discerned, answered in, My name, authority, character, report, mark, and nature." Psalm 91:14
Offline Big Rich  
#8 Posted : Thursday, October 2, 2008 1:28:21 PM(UTC)
Big Rich
Joined: 9/2/2008(UTC)
Posts: 62
Location: Indiana

Agreed, I guess I just have to adjust my ideas about what I'm going to/can accomplish.

Well I sent it in last night and it wasn't in this morning. I guess I can just wait and see if they put it in tommorow. Of course, seeing as it's a home football weekend, I'd tend to doubt it. Generally they try to kill any good controversy before the alums get here. :)
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