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Offline Yada  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, August 26, 2008 12:50:19 PM(UTC)
Yada
Joined: 6/28/2007(UTC)
Posts: 3,537

The following is an exchange between "DS" and Yada:

Quote:
On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:48 AM, DS wrote:

you have convinced me. no more thythes. do you have any suggestions where to redirect that money or not at all?
thanks,

-d


Yada's response:

Quote:
D,

I'd ask Yahweh to show you where He wants you to invest in the lives and souls of others. As you engage in the world around you, and as you read the Scriptures and ponder them, opportunities will abound.

Yada
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Offline Yahshuaslavejeff  
#2 Posted : Thursday, September 4, 2008 11:35:55 PM(UTC)
Yahshuaslavejeff
Joined: 5/12/2008(UTC)
Posts: 55
Location: Israel / oklahoma

מלכים ב 14 (The Westminster Leningrad Codex) 12 וַיִּנָּ֥גֶף יְהוּדָ֖ה לִפְנֵ֣י יִשְׂרָאֵ֑ל וַיָּנֻ֖סוּ אִ֥ישׁ
Offline visitor  
#3 Posted : Friday, September 5, 2008 2:51:15 AM(UTC)
visitor
Joined: 6/13/2007(UTC)
Posts: 77

I'm still confused about thything. Is this something we should be doing? If so, how and to whom?

Here are a couple of passages from Scripture:

Quote:
Leviticus 27:30-33 (New Living Translation)

30 “One tenth of the produce of the land, whether grain from the fields or fruit from the trees, belongs to the Lord and must be set apart to him as holy. 31 If you want to buy back the Lord’s tenth of the grain or fruit, you must pay its value, plus 20 percent. 32 Count off every tenth animal from your herds and flocks and set them apart for the Lord as holy. 33 You may not pick and choose between good and bad animals, and you may not substitute one for another. But if you do exchange one animal for another, then both the original animal and its substitute will be considered holy and cannot be bought back.”


Quote:
Malachi 3:8-12 (New Living Translation)

8 “Should people cheat God? Yet you have cheated me!

“But you ask, ‘What do you mean? When did we ever cheat you?’

“You have cheated me of the tithes and offerings due to me. 9 You are under a curse, for your whole nation has been cheating me. 10 Bring all the tithes into the storehouse so there will be enough food in my Temple. If you do,” says the Lord of Heaven’s Armies, “I will open the windows of heaven for you. I will pour out a blessing so great you won’t have enough room to take it in! Try it! Put me to the test! 11 Your crops will be abundant, for I will guard them from insects and disease.[a] Your grapes will not fall from the vine before they are ripe,” says the Lord of Heaven’s Armies. 12 “Then all nations will call you blessed, for your land will be such a delight,” says the Lord of Heaven’s Armies.


Quote:
Matthew 23:23 (New Living Translation)

23 “What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you are careful to tithe even the tiniest income from your herb gardens,[a] but you ignore the more important aspects of the law—justice, mercy, and faith. You should tithe, yes, but do not neglect the more important things.


Thanks for your help.
Offline BiynaYahu  
#4 Posted : Friday, September 5, 2008 6:20:31 AM(UTC)
BiynaYahu
Joined: 4/5/2008(UTC)
Posts: 314
Man
Location: British Columbia, Canada

Grace and love from YAHUWEH the all-powerful god,

First I want to point out that I own a copy of the New Living Translation, and even when I was a christian I realized that when they modernize the english. Change it as to be more easily understood many times they twist it completely from it's original meaning. One such point is during the prayer of the Ephesians when Paulos asks for us to receive the spirit of truth, or if you will a greater portion of the set-apart spirit. They change it to spiritual truth which isn't in any way the same thing. While it is a nice thought, and we could all use a little spiritual truth, it's not what Paulos prayed for the Ephesians. Secondly, I think it's important to understand what the tithe was for; To help the widowed, the orphan, the homeless, the handicapped. I mean back then it went to the temple, and also served to support the Lewites, but now since the temple, and the Lewites are no more I think in place of a literal tithe we should all just do our best to help those around us in need. Hopefully we can all get to the point where we give much more than ten percent of our income. Hope this helped.

Your loving brother,
Mike Br.
Someone who does not dearly love or welcome, entertain, look fondly upon or cherish people with strong affection or highly esteem them with great favour, goodwill or benevolence, be loyal to or greatly adore them has not known or understood, perceived or realized, noticed or discerned, discovered or observed, experienced or ascertained, learned about or distinguished, comprehended, acknowledged or recognized God*, for concerning this, God* is and exists as brotherly love and affection, good will, esteem and benevolence.
Offline bitnet  
#5 Posted : Friday, September 5, 2008 7:08:22 AM(UTC)
bitnet
Joined: 7/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,120

Shabbat Shalom,

The offerings were to be given to the Lewites, a tribe that depended on the generosity of their brethren. However, since the diaspora, there is no priestly caste that is in charge of the temple and therefore no need for the tithe as there is nobody to support. However, it is almost imperative that each person invests in discovering Truth and the Way to Yahweh. Not only should we spend on research materials, we each need to find the time to do what is important, which is to unite with our Creator according to His plan, and with each other. Those are the prime motives for our lives here now. If we seek Him diligently and earnestly, and follow His Word, He shall bless us accordingly. I dare say that our most precious tithe shall be of time, in keeping the Sabbaths and the Miqra.

However, it has been a tradition of men to usurp the Creator and take His position and demand financial support from the people in exchange for spiritual bounty. This path led to the establishment of a "ruling elite" which imposes their ideas and thoughts upon men, binding them to doctrines and traditions that uphold themselves at the expense of the donor. And as these "ruling elite" pursue their needs ahead of men, they fail themselves and their followers for their practices eventually puts them at odds against each other and creates strife amongst the nations. Furthermore, if all the priests, pastors, imams, mullahs, monks and nuns in the world worked to support themselves, they would not be a financial burden to the world. There is much more to be said about how a person's money can be used to further deception more than Truth. In our ignorance we have given where we should not because we knew not and acted on faith. If nobody supported these teachers, less deception would have taken place. Instead, we paid to hear lies when the Truth is free! That is why it is written that "My people perish for a lack of knowledge."

Abba Yahweh does not need our money. He already owns everything... and a few dollars from each of us does not do anything for Him. What He wants from us is a willingness to do His Will. We need to invest in learning His Ways and then He shall bless us abundantly. And if you have extra to give, give to the members of the ekklesia first so that their urgent needs may be met. Then you may give to the widows and orphans, and the aged and the sick, who will always be with us until Messiyah Yahushua returns.
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline Matthew  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, October 7, 2008 4:42:06 AM(UTC)
Matthew
Joined: 10/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,191
Man
Location: São Paulo, Brazil

Was thanked: 3 time(s) in 2 post(s)
And what about the Disciples just after the ascension of the Messiah? Were they in a position of "full-time ministers" because it certainly seems so. I'm just asking this because I can see Christians using this to justify giving tithes to support their pastors.
Offline bitnet  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, October 7, 2008 5:49:41 AM(UTC)
bitnet
Joined: 7/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,120

Shalom,

We read that even Shaul/Paul kept up his profession as tent-maker despite being the most learned/knowledgeable of all the apostles. Several leaders use Scripture to seek a living from the flock, citing a right to the offerings given to the Lewites and priests as they claim to be in such a position. I know of poor pastors administering to small congregations and rich pastors in megachurches, all of whom derive their sustenance from their flock. I suppose that it is up to their them and their flock to decide on matters pertaining to such. But what if they do not have enough followers? Would they start preaching something else to sustain their lives? Would they tickle the ears of their congregation by telling them what they want to hear. All I know is that Truth should be free, as in this website. However, it takes resources to operate such an effort and offerings are always appreciated. Just remember that in times past when Yahweh was in charge and the Lewites and priests were doing His bidding in His Temple, He commanded tithes from the people to sustain those in His service. Today, it is difficult to determine who exactly is in His service. Whatever you do for them, do it out of faith but be ready to change once you realise that Truth does not come out of their mouths. Better yet, do with your money what you do know for sure... continue to seek Yahweh and His Word. The rest will come later.
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline shalom82  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, October 7, 2008 12:03:49 PM(UTC)
shalom82
Joined: 9/10/2007(UTC)
Posts: 735
Location: Penna

Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
Shalom Aleichem,
This is only my humble opinion, but I think that the tithe at this point in time cannot be administered in it's original literal format and I do not think that we should go out trying to find a substitute system that is some sort of "close enough". We simply should do our best to to carry out the spirit of the tithe. We can still give to the orphan, the widow, and the stranger.

Personally, I think that whatever money it takes to set up a congregation, build a meeting house or study hall, and whatever money it takes to support functionaries...pastors...and the like, should be a free will offering and not considered a tithe. It's not wrong to hire a pastor or have a meeting house, but we shouldn't mix up intents and purposes. Now...that being said...I think it is legitimate to give your tithe to the leader(s) of the congregation for distribution.

That is my humble opinion.

Yibarekhem YHWH

Shalom
YHWH's ordinances are true, and righteous altogether.
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