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Offline Robskiwarrior  
#1 Posted : Sunday, June 22, 2008 2:19:03 PM(UTC)
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Hello all. :)

Recently Yah has been poking me about healing. That is a different story altogether, that if I feel the need to post - or if someone would like me to post - I shall explain about.

So healing... at its base, what is it? Reliance on Yah... no?

Yah has been poking me about healing and about the medical profession, and how it takes our reliance off Him and onto man. So I have been doing some digging into the symbols of the medical industry that I would like to share and get some feedback from others in regards to it. :)

Ok in the "drugged" chapter of YY, Yada does talk about this, although I have probably not read that chapter in over a year now. I decided to do some of my own digging.

We have looked at symbols quite a lot in the forums, especially in regards to leadership and the illuminati / One World Order stuff. I have done a little digging recently into the symbols of the medical world.

Firstly we have the most recognisable symbol:

UserPostedImage

As you can see, it's 2 snakes around a rod, with some nice wing like things at the top...

This is the symbol I recognise most for medical things, and that's probably more thanks to American TV, as it's NOT actually the real symbol for medical things universally. See the following quote:

Wikipedia wrote:
The caduceus (/kəˈduːsiəs/, -ʃəs, -ˈdjuː-; kerykeion in Greek) or wand of Hermes is typically depicted as a short herald's staff entwined by two serpents in the form of a double helix, and sometimes surmounted by wings. In later Antiquity the caduceus was an astrological symbol of commerce and in Roman iconography was often depicted being carried in the left hand of the Greek god Hermes, the messenger of the gods, conductor of the dead and protector of merchants and thieves.

The caduceus has come to be used as a symbol for medicine, especially in North America, by confusion with the traditional medical symbol, the rod of Asclepius, which has only a single snake and no wings.


So what IS the symbol that should be used, and is it any better than twisting serpents and Greek gods...

The simple answer is.... no.

UserPostedImage UserPostedImage

This is the actual symbol, before (what wikipedia calls)' the north American corruption...' (oh the irony...)

So what does this mean?

Wikipedia wrote:
The rod of Asclepius (also known as the rod of Asklepios, rod of Aesculapius or asklepian[1]) is an ancient Greek symbol associated with astrology and with healing the sick through medicine. It consists of a serpent entwined around a staff. Asclepius, the son of Apollo, was a practitioner of medicine in ancient Greek mythology.

The rod of Asclepius symbolizes the healing arts by combining the serpent, which in shedding its skin is a symbol of rebirth and fertility, with the staff, a symbol of authority befitting the god of Medicine. The snake wrapped around the staff is widely claimed to be a species of rat snake, Elaphe longissima, also known as the Aesculapian or Asclepian snake. It is native to south eastern Europe, Asia Minor, and some central European spa regions, apparently brought there by Romans for their healing properties.


Now, we obviously know that these aren’t the greatest symbols to link to something that does so much "good"... but what else can we glean from the image?

Snakes in scripture - what picture prophetically does it paint?

Short answer? Satan and demon's in general.

Yada Yahweh wrote:
Yahushua explained why the pontificators and perpetrators of deception, destruction, death, and damnation would "receive (lambano - procure for themselves and experience) the greater (perissos - beyond measure and abundant; exceedingly supreme and uncommon; vehement and persistent; forceful, impassioned, intense, and bitterly antagonistic) damnation (krima - condemnation, penal judgment, judicial penalty, punishment, criminal sentence)." They were born of the spirit from below... "You serpents (ophis - snakes displaying deception and cunning), you are born (gennema) of vipers (echidna - poisonous and venomous snakes, malignant serpents). By what means (pos) will you escape (pheugo - be saved from, elude or avoid), the damnation (krisis - separation, trial, judgment and justice; condemnation and punishment) of Gehenna (gorge of dead animals, refuse and filth)?" (Matthew 23:33)


This is one of many examples used and I think we all know that the use of snakes in prophetic language is to symbolise things that aren’t particularly "of Yah".

Surely this is a sign for us? A warning? Medical staff do so much good and save so many lives, surely it can't be of Satan? Surely Yah can use these people?

I don’t know anymore... from what Yah has been saying to me we should be reliant on Him and expect the miraculous.

This isn't a stab at any profession in particular, doc's or nurses - I grew up in hospitals as my parents worked in them all my life (they retired recently)

If I was going for a long shot on the whole image of the snake around the staff, I would say it's a picture of Satan entangling himself around the upright pole... Satan knows what he’s doing...

I’m trying to sound out ideas really... What does everyone else think?

Edited by user Monday, June 23, 2008 12:44:45 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Offline Tiffany  
#2 Posted : Sunday, June 22, 2008 7:43:38 PM(UTC)
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Rob,

I agree with you and the imagery is less than desirable. I have struggled with this myself but I believe that despite the symbols that a lot of the doctors and nurses are in the profession for the right reasons. I also trust and believe Yah for the healing of my body both physically and spiritually.

The question that I have been struggling with lately is this whole disaster coming out of Lakeland FL with Todd Bentley and his "healing revival" it’s horrible and the stories that are coming out of it will make your skin crawl. That being said they claim it to be a move of God, and I would most likely say that it is Satan all the way. So it seems to me that all things Yah can use for good Satan can use for bad disguised as good.

And like I said above Yah is my source and I trust him to either heal me or bring someone who can aid returning my body to full health.
Offline bitnet  
#3 Posted : Sunday, June 22, 2008 8:10:51 PM(UTC)
bitnet
Joined: 7/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,120

Shalom,

One of the things that escape many people is the difference between the two staves mentioned above. However, they both belong to a pagan system that do not acknowledge the Creator. Contrary to what you think the caduceus of Hermes is not chosen wrongly! It was chosen because it is "an astrological symbol of commerce" and in respect "of Hermes, the messenger of the gods, conductor of the dead and protector of merchants and thieves."

The whole healthcare system has been turned on its head and become a medium to generate huge profits at the expense of the people. The people who fund healthcare research (drugs) also fund universities who turn out the personnel trained to use the drugs and methods that they develop in hospitals that they own financed by money taken from a financial system that is managed by them! Party to these incestuous relationships are governments which depend on the whole system to keep the population in reasonable health. The governments depend on the research and development and private sector contributions to keep the system going, and as such also plays ball by giving big pharma, hospitals universities and other players the leeway to control required resources.

That said, governments also do not encourage an ageing population that soaks up resources and close their eyes to a system that usually limits people's life to less than 80 years when Scripture and science says that we can live up to 120 years. If people were to truly learn that prevention is better than cure, the hospitals will go broke along with big pharma as well as governments! The herbal revival is a threat and alternative therapies are throwing spanners into their work so they are consistently attacking and discrediting natural cures. You can be sure that whatever allowances given to non-conventional therapies shall be closely watched. Incidentally, iatrogenic deaths in hospitals has become the leading cause of deaths in American hospitals, and not heart disease, accidents and cancer. Check out http://www.ourcivilisati...dicine/usamed/deaths.htm and seek out related articles on the web

So if you are a fan of Connections and know who James Burke is, please ask him to do a special episode on healthcare, education, finance, agriculture, governance and the pagan gods. For too long we have been playing with a deck of cards that was dealt from the bottom and expect to win, but the sharks at the table are working with each other to fleece you out of health and money.

Edited by user Sunday, June 22, 2008 9:55:48 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline Robskiwarrior  
#4 Posted : Sunday, June 22, 2008 11:50:15 PM(UTC)
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Thanks for the replys guys :D

bitnet wrote:
Shalom,
One of the things that escape many people is the difference between the two staves mentioned above. However, they both belong to a pagan system that do not acknowledge the Creator. Contrary to what you think the caduceus of Hermes is not chosen wrongly! It was chosen because it is "an astrological symbol of commerce" and in respect "of Hermes, the messenger of the gods, conductor of the dead and protector of merchants and thieves."


Well thats what I thought, because the twin snaked staff is just as good a description for the medical profession - there isnt too much dis-simalarity in their history, both gods linked with healing of sorts...


Tiffany wrote:
The question that I have been struggling with lately is this whole disaster coming out of Lakeland FL with Todd Bentley and his "healing revival" it’s horrible and the stories that are coming out of it will make your skin crawl. That being said they claim it to be a move of God, and I would most likely say that it is Satan all the way. So it seems to me that all things Yah can use for good Satan can use for bad disguised as good.


Yes we have been looking into Mr Bentley, and its very worrying - and I think swalchy, myself and Ju would agree 100% with you on that one lol


Tiffany wrote:
And like I said above Yah is my source and I trust him to either heal me or bring someone who can aid returning my body to full health.


Is this really reliance though? I mean I suppose it would be if you waited for Yah to physically bring you the doctor? If you walked into the hospital then surely that is you choosing man's solution over Yah's?

Sorry, I'm not attacking your beliefs, as you have said exactly what I would say. I'm just trying to get to the bottom of our logic for trusting in something that hides behind such a, well, satanic symbol.
Signature Updated! Woo that was old...
Offline bitnet  
#5 Posted : Monday, June 23, 2008 1:38:43 AM(UTC)
bitnet
Joined: 7/3/2007(UTC)
Posts: 1,120

Shalom,

One of the problems that we have is that we are still largely dependent on others for physical healing. This debate has gone on unabated in some Christian denominations that regard the medical profession with disdain, and a total reliance upon God is a prerequisite for healing. But I would not venture so far as to say that this displaces faith (in each individual) in the Eternal who provides according to our needs in various times. We've all heard the story about the chap during the flood...

The river broke its banks and flooded a small town. As the water began to rise, people were to told to evacuate. Anthony decided to put his things up on the first floor and wait. When a Red Cross rescue truck came by, Anthony waived him off from the top of a table saying, "Don't worry about me, God will save me." The waters continued to rise and Anthony moved up to the first floor balcony. A Red Cross rescue boat came by but Anthony said, "I have faith that God will save me. You go on helping others." However, the waters continued to rise and Anthony was forced up to the roof. An army rescue helicopter came by to pull Anthony to safety but again Anthony said, "I am sure that God will prove to be my saviour. I have faith in him." And the helicopter left. Soon after, the flood waters swept Anthony off and he drowned. After passing through Pearly Gates, Anthony asked God, "I had faith in you, God, so why did you not save me?" God answered, "I sent a rescue truck, a boat and a helicopter but you refused to get on. So what am I to do?"

The matter of relying on hospitals is not unreasonable as the people are trained to deal with disease and injury, albeit up to a certain point. Don't forget that there may also be fellow believers who are honestly administering to the best of their abilities in healthcare. They may be in the system but not really part thereof. What is important is for us to trust that whatever action is taken is in accordance with His will for us to have healthy meaningful lives, and not live for the sake of being kept alive on machines, if you get my drift. Asking Abba Yahweh to heal us is an important part of our faith, but we must also avoid potential health problems! We cannot keep standing in the middle of a busy road and pray that a truck will not hit us. We have to move off to the kerb to a safe place.

Likewise, there are laws and principles of health that must be observed. Many people do not know these laws and succumb to their deleterious effects. For instance, not many people die of vector-borne diseases in developed countries but the cause of death by degenerative diseases is very high. That is because not many people understand that they are living in a chemical soup that affects their bodies. The soaps, shampoos, toothpaste, skin lotions, sunblock, cosmetics, dishwash and clothes detergent, etc. contain potentially harmful chemicals that may cause cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc. The diets that we keep also affect our bodies. Leviticus and Deuteronomy contain gems of advice regarding safe healthy diets but we must be careful about modern GMO foods and chemical concoctions passed off as beverages as well as cigarettes and suchlike. Even if we are careful enough about these things, there are still no guarantees and we may be infected by a germ through a mosquito bite. But if we rely on Abba Yahweh to keep us healthy while taking all these precautions, it is unlikely that we shall fall ill easily. I'm not saying that it is foolproof but there is some effort required on our part. When He parted the Red Sea, the people had to cross themselves and not wait to be carried across to the other side.

So is it reliance on modern medical care that we place our faith into? Such that it jeopardises our personal faith? According to your faith, be it unto you. And let no man judge you for this should you wish to see a doctor for treatment and a prescription. That said, I am also thinking that we do have among the ekklesia members who are gifted with the powers of healing. Should you find yourself with this gift, please share it with us so that we may be healed through prayer. But remember that we must do our part and not partake of products that compromise our health in the first place. My business is in helping people understand this first important principle so that we do not put ourselves or Yahweh to the test.
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline Robskiwarrior  
#6 Posted : Monday, June 23, 2008 2:17:27 AM(UTC)
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bitnet wrote:


The river broke its banks and flooded a small town. As the water began to rise, people were to told to evacuate. Anthony decided to put his things up on the first floor and wait. When a Red Cross rescue truck came by, Anthony waived him off from the top of a table saying, "Don't worry about me, God will save me." The waters continued to rise and Anthony moved up to the first floor balcony. A Red Cross rescue boat came by but Anthony said, "I have faith that God will save me. You go on helping others." However, the waters continued to rise and Anthony was forced up to the roof. An army rescue helicopter came by to pull Anthony to safety but again Anthony said, "I am sure that God will prove to be my saviour. I have faith in him." And the helicopter left. Soon after, the flood waters swept Anthony off and he drowned. After passing through Pearly Gates, Anthony asked God, "I had faith in you, God, so why did you not save me?" God answered, "I sent a rescue truck, a boat and a helicopter but you refused to get on. So what am I to do?"


hehe I knew this story would come up :)

Yea and again, your reasoning is sensible and logical, as is Tiff's.

But what if moving towards the medical practices is a result of our relationship not being "in full" but tarnished by what we are told to believe and what we have experianced?

I suppose im trying to get at the fact that its not about testing Yah, but resting on Him. He is our Father, as a father myself I know that the first thing I want to do with my kids when they are hurt or ill is make it better... now if I had that ability I would do that. If my kids hurt themselfs, they come to us and we can give them a nice hug, kiss and rub the sore bit and then its all better. We are told to rely on Him for everything, why not this? Is it because its such a "big ask"? Is it because we are scared of something not happening? Is it because we have been told by preacher after preacher that healing requires you to have the magical word "faith"?

Our Father wants to provide us with every need we have. When I say need, I mean need and not want... This kinda brings me onto the scriptual basis for medical practice, and the question - is there any? And if there is, does Yah approve of it?

Again I stress, i'm not sure what I believe - but I want to dig this one into truth, what you guys have answered is what I would have answered aslo - but I want a deeper understanding, and I want to make sure of what I think Yah is teaching me. Im not saying eveyone stop going to hospital! lol

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Offline Icy  
#7 Posted : Monday, June 23, 2008 2:22:58 AM(UTC)
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I knew there was a reason I don't like doctors. Well, I knew it before this thread, as I have recently been debating with a nurse friend about doctors beign motivated my money. I thought she would agree, but she thinks they are mostivated by their values, and most value helping others over money. Her issue is the hospitals (as they are corporations) and the pharmacutical companies. Many doctors do fall prey to the pharmacuticals that pass out free things and give incentives to doctors to write prescriptions for certain drugs.

Years ago, I knew a youth pastor that was diagnossed with diabetes. He felt "God" telling him that he needed to fast and pray. So, against his doctor's request for him to not do this, and being told it would likely kill him, he checked into a hotel for three days and fasted and prayed. He did not die. In fact, when he went back to the doctor, he no longer had diabetes.

I think that is the kind of reliance on Yah that Rob is talking about. But, there are religious groups that completely forsake all doctors and say all healing should come through prayer to "God." Alot of these people die for easily curable things. Maybe it is because they rely on "God" and not Yahuweh? Or, perhaps we should make use of the resources provided to us and getting help from doctors is not a bad thing, as long as you keep your faith in Yahuweh that he will heal you and that you are not putting your faith in the doctor to heal you. The doctor is just a tool that Yahuweh is using.

All that said, other than major surgaries, I find that most doctors I have ever met are incompetent and know nothing more than I do. I have diagnosed myself and everyone I know long before a doctor does, and have cured these thins with natural remedies when doctors just want to run more tests and prescribe copious amounts of poisonous drugs.
Offline Robskiwarrior  
#8 Posted : Monday, June 23, 2008 2:51:23 AM(UTC)
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Icy wrote:

Years ago, I knew a youth pastor that was diagnossed with diabetes. He felt "God" telling him that he needed to fast and pray. So, against his doctor's request for him to not do this, and being told it would likely kill him, he checked into a hotel for three days and fasted and prayed. He did not die. In fact, when he went back to the doctor, he no longer had diabetes.

I think that is the kind of reliance on Yah that Rob is talking about.


Yes thats definitly in the same direction

Icy wrote:
But, there are religious groups that completely forsake all doctors and say all healing should come through prayer to "God." Alot of these people die for easily curable things. Maybe it is because they rely on "God" and not Yahuweh? Or, perhaps we should make use of the resources provided to us and getting help from doctors is not a bad thing, as long as you keep your faith in Yahuweh that he will heal you and that you are not putting your faith in the doctor to heal you. The doctor is just a tool that Yahuweh is using.


But the thing is, are these people dying because of lack of "faith" OR lack of "Yada" (not you yada... I mean personal and relational knowledge) and obediance that comes from a loving father/child relationship? I think the key words in there are "religious groups"

Icy wrote:

All that said, other than major surgaries, I find that most doctors I have ever met are incompetent and know nothing more than I do. I have diagnosed myself and everyone I know long before a doctor does, and have cured these thins with natural remedies when doctors just want to run more tests and prescribe copious amounts of poisonous drugs.


For this our doctor is quite scaree, as in he once gave me a double dose of antibiotics for me and my wife - without even seeing my wife and knowing her situation or allergies... But then I know there are lots of very knowledgeable doctors, being brought up in a hospital familiy, I have known lots of different types all in different areas.
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Offline Tiffany  
#9 Posted : Wednesday, June 25, 2008 8:34:17 PM(UTC)
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Quote:
I suppose im trying to get at the fact that its not about testing Yah, but resting on Him. He is our Father, as a father myself I know that the first thing I want to do with my kids when they are hurt or ill is make it better... now if I had that ability I would do that. If my kids hurt themselfs, they come to us and we can give them a nice hug, kiss and rub the sore bit and then its all better. We are told to rely on Him for everything, why not this? Is it because its such a "big ask"?


I don’t believe that going to a hospital to seek medical treatment is a lack of trusting Yah, or even a lack of resting in him. I believe hospitals are business and they are in the business to make money, and doctors for the right and wrong reason do what they do and I have to trust that Yah will provided me a doctor when and only when needed. I rarely go to the hospital it’s lately been because of some one has died.

Let me ask you this, being that you are a dad, were your children born at a hospital? See I had a friend who almost lost a baby and the mother because of complications during delivery had they been at a hospital from the start the outcome would have been different. The critical thing is finding a doctor who supports your value and your wishes above theirs when it does not impair their ability to do a good job. If you want to lock your self in a room and wait, do it. If Yah tells you to go the hospital and you choose not to because your have "faith" I would be likely to say its not faith but pride. Proverbs is very clear about pride and what it will do to us and our surrounding. So either way I doubt that answers your question but that is what I think.
Offline Robskiwarrior  
#10 Posted : Wednesday, June 25, 2008 10:33:08 PM(UTC)
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Tiffany wrote:


I don’t believe that going to a hospital to seek medical treatment is a lack of trusting Yah, or even a lack of resting in him. I believe hospitals are business and they are in the business to make money, and doctors for the right and wrong reason do what they do and I have to trust that Yah will provided me a doctor when and only when needed. I rarely go to the hospital it’s lately been because of some one has died.

Let me ask you this, being that you are a dad, were your children born at a hospital? See I had a friend who almost lost a baby and the mother because of complications during delivery had they been at a hospital from the start the outcome would have been different. The critical thing is finding a doctor who supports your value and your wishes above theirs when it does not impair their ability to do a good job. If you want to lock your self in a room and wait, do it. If Yah tells you to go the hospital and you choose not to because your have "faith" I would be likely to say its not faith but pride. Proverbs is very clear about pride and what it will do to us and our surrounding. So either way I doubt that answers your question but that is what I think.


Hi Tiff, thanks for the response again, don’t worry your answers are great :)

Yes my kids were born in a hospital, and I am fighting AGAINST Ju to have a home birth for the next one :D I WANT to go to hospital; I mean that’s where all the doctors are!!! :D We had to take my eldest daughter to hospital for the first time ever a few months ago after she cut her leg open, very deeply - it needed gluing back together. Of course if Yah told me to go to the hospital and I didn’t that would be pride, but I’m not a big fan of faith either... I just remember my first reaction for Beth was to get her to the hospital, but there was something else saying you don’t need too...

I’m not a faith healer nor do I believe in faith healing, I don’t even know what kind of healing I believe in, I just believe for some possibly illogical reason (it is illogical even to me) that Yah wants to heal as naturally as I breathe or eat. And also that when I look at the symbols that the medical profession hide behind it rings large alarm bells... I mean spiritual healers don’t use symbolism that looks as bad as that - and they still get results... they are nice people who want to help, and some of them are very good, but does that mean I should trust them over Yah? The medical profession is just people again, and because they actually dive into your body and physically remove or change things, does that mean I should trust them? They are also nice people... they might not say any prayers or wave any crystals, but they don’t half have a bad symbol for there organisation...

So I’m not trying to be proud or say that I will only trust Yah in that proud way... but I kind of want to say I will only trust Him, because He is truth and is real and wants to keep me well and heal my body. I know He wants to, as much as I know He keeps us in cloths and with food each week. I really wish I could put across properly what I mean...

What do you think?


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Offline bitnet  
#11 Posted : Wednesday, June 25, 2008 11:09:53 PM(UTC)
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Healers are healers, and if they are not against the Kingdom of Yahweh then there is no problem. But be careful not to give your lives over to them! Many people I know have done just that and paid dearly, despite the alternatives that Abba Yahweh has provided.
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline Tiffany  
#12 Posted : Saturday, June 28, 2008 7:23:21 PM(UTC)
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Rob,

I totally respect what you think and I think I really would fall more in line with the direction your heart is leading you. I am having this thought right now in regards to ultimate trust in Yah for everything we need...

See I have been feeling the need to prepare for the future and we know where that is leading us, but as I have been thinking about it I think this is our dress rehearsal for what is to come. We need to trust fully ( I am more speaking to myself) because there will be a time (sooner, than I want) where the modern comforts of Wal-mart, Mac-Donald’s, and other close convenience may not be so close and I will have to trust more.

Life is what it is I think most of what we are learning now will be solid good lessons for us in the future. If we don’t learn from our past we are deemed to repeat it, so I plan on learning and using what I learn to be ready for whatever Yah bring my way!
Offline Robskiwarrior  
#13 Posted : Sunday, June 29, 2008 2:26:04 AM(UTC)
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Thanks to both of you for your answers. It still plays on my mind a fair bit - but to recent circumstances being that Todd Bentley is trying to take over the world I have been devoting alot of time to learning about him and where this revival comes from.

On another note - are the forums really slow for anyone else - or is it just me?

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Offline Icy  
#14 Posted : Sunday, June 29, 2008 2:55:16 AM(UTC)
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They are slow for me too.
Offline Robskiwarrior  
#15 Posted : Sunday, June 29, 2008 5:39:07 AM(UTC)
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Icy wrote:
They are slow for me too.


all ok now though LOL
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Offline bitnet  
#16 Posted : Sunday, June 29, 2008 5:51:29 AM(UTC)
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Yeah, it was real slow for a whole day and I started thinking that we may have had a DoS attack... but it seems quite normal now. Yada, are they doing something to the server? Can we afford to mirror at another site? How much do we need? I'm sure that if it is not too expensive we could spring a few bucks each to ensure a higher redundancy level. (Sorry... techspeak for better uptime.) Oooops... sorry... seems that this is off thread... unless we consider the server sick and...
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline jojocc  
#17 Posted : Monday, August 4, 2008 4:13:34 AM(UTC)
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Hate to sound like some sort of tree-hugging hippy, but everything we need is around us.

YHWH has provided for us, he has given us good things to eat - although humanity as a whole appears to be attempting to twist this as much as possible. He has given us what are now called 'natural', 'alternative' or 'herbal' medicines for ailments, including apricot kernels or Oleander soup for cancer, garlic for heart desease etc...

In terms of relying on YHWH, I think that one way to do this is to rely on what YHWH has given us. One thing I have realised is that mankind will tend to twist and corrupt everything that we have as a result of the ability to judge good from evil. If we arethe masters of our own world, then it is our job to make it 'better'.

I beleive that YHWH has given us everything we need, all we have to do is ask him what to use for this, that etc... I also think one of the main aims behind the 'Witch Hunts' that spread through Europe and the States in the 15th-18th centuries, was to destroy our knowledge of herb and healing lore and to enforce our dependancy on 'modern' manufactured medicine. I strongly think that we should be looking at returning to the ancient healing methods, many of which are outlined in the Tanakh - especially the bits about keeping clean!!!

Just like bitnet sais, if we eat properly (will be growing my own tomatoes soon) and keep away from the nasty chemicals that permeate every inch of our lives (including our water) and we depend on YHWH and what he has put here for us, I think we should find that we are ok.

As far as broken bones and deep cuts go - definately need docaters n hopitals for that until we have the knowledge to deal with things ourselves.

And who knew - as obviosly not aligned with YHWH as they are, Aerosmith made some really good music!!! (off topic I know, but just listening to their greatest hits album for the first time ever)
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