In Book III : Going Astray, in the Thanatos chapter, we find;










Then we find this in the same chapter;



It sounded to me as if Yada was saying that Chavvah would endure the fate of the adversary for aligning w/ him and leading others astray, but then said that the longest sentence is Cains, rather than Chavvah's. What am I missing? Thanks

I too am attempting to sort out Yada's Genesis account of Adam's fall and family and look forward to the remaining YY book I chapters to fill in the gaps. I agree with KP about Adam's wife being duped rather than malicious, however their actions still had consequences.

I've given the topic of the fall some thought and suspect that Adam and his wife while not programmed or predestined to fall were permitted a valid test of choice Yah permitted knowing they what choice they would make. I think of the garden as a playground they were placed in and while protected and free to do as they pleased while inside, they had but one means of breaking their fellowship. Essentially the garden had a single exit. These two had a few differences from ourselves. They began their existence in fellowship with and walking with Yah. We began not in fellowship with Yah, but with a capacity to seek and choose to enter into fellowship with Yah. While they could walk and enjoy fellowship with Yah, they had only one means of breaking that fellowship and after that be in a position to appreciate the value of the intimate relationship they had always enjoyed before.

In addition to what KP mentioned on accepting the animal skin garments, I note that their kids offered sacrfices to Yahuweh. I suspect that their parents now being outside the playground appreciated what they lost and sought restored fellowship and expressed themselves on this point to their kids. While others may assume Adam's fall resulted in a shared fate with the advesary, my conclusion is that his repentance would result in restored eternal fellowship even if he had to endure the eventual separation of body and soul.

Edited by user Friday, July 27, 2007 7:19:53 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

I confess that I've found it difficult to fully comprehend the offerings by these brothers and the different reactions each received and had, but think you nailed it. Yahuweh later (in Hosea?) talks about the worthelessness of sacrafices (presumadely even non-veggie ones) when a persons heart is far from Him.

It seemed odd to me that each brother gave of their inclinations and gifting (flocks or fields) but that the reaction produced should be so extreme. I had initially though Abel's offering was accepted because it better pictured the shedding of blood needed to cover over sin (pointing to Yahushua at calvary). A non-believer commenting on Cain's murderous reaction asked something like this:

Humor aside, I see his point of Cain's extreme over reaction, however we know that Yahuweh had warned Cain to master sin. Also that Yahushua talked of speaking harshly to one's brother as being the spiritual equivelent of murdering him in one's heart.

Pondering

Well said Jeanie. If we are truely passionate about Yahuweh then we are not just this side of nuts we are really over the edge and excited about it. Let's face it when this soaks in and you believe it there is no turning back.

As far as Chavvah goes, and this is my own opinion, if there is no redemption for Adam and Chavvah then there is no redemption for any of us. When they separated themselves from Yahuweh by eating the fruit, He came looking for them as He always did when he was walking in the garden in the cool of the day. When their sin became public he sacrificed and shed blood for them and they accepted the sacrifice and the covering (blood). Redemption - He paid the price to buy them back from the adversary. Millenia later he did the same thing for us, only the lamb that was sacrificed was Yahushua who was hung on an upright pole. The blood that covers us is the same as the blood that covers them, and yes I did say covers because it is all his blood and it still covers us all today.

When we try to use our intellectual brain to figure Yahuweh and what he is doing out we are really missing the mark. He said himself that his things are spiritually discerned and that the Set Apart and Cleansing Spirit will lead and guide us into ALL the truth. When we try to figure him out rather than taking him at his word I think we have crossed the line from being nuts for him to being absolutely insane for not believing what he said. He is not a man that he should lie.

Looking forward to some feedback.

I have to agree too Jeff, you hit the nail on the head as to say there :)

I love it! All of these wonderful ideas in one string its great!!!

As for me, this is what I have to say....Yes Yehuweh!

I do however have a question about Adam and Chavvah, when I was attending a church a few years ago someone said that both of them had book they had written and I was wondering if there was any validity to this statement. As the person who stated that said she had read them and could sense the depression in their voices as they now knew their choice had taken away from them the very life they had always wanted.

It’s obviously not in the OC, but just curious if anyone else has ever seen it??

Thanks!

I'm guessing Tiffany is asking if anyone has heard any support for the claim that a book details the Adam's sorrow or depressed state in his life and presumadely his wife as well?

I can speculate that these two would have a unique perspective on life, having enjoyed a sinless close existence with Yahuweh in the garden, and later heving experienced the fall and their fallen state would not be surprised if they were depressed or longing for a return.

As for documentation, I recall in POD the Islamic claim that Adam was a prophet and recieved "books'. I don't doubt that Adam related to his kids what he had experienced and taught his kids to seek and revere Yahuweh. I suppose that would make him a prophet. I don't know that Adam wrote books or was literate for that matter?

While not regarded as Scripture, the ancient book of Enoch may have some mention of this notion and may be what this person is thinking of.

Edited by user Sunday, July 29, 2007 4:42:54 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Well it's not a book that I have heard of but I think that any one of us who have sinned since we met Yahuweh, turning away from Him, could write that book from our own experience of how it feels to be alone in the world without a relationship with our creator,Yahuweh.

I am pretty sure that anyone that has been in that position could easily explain what it felt like when you realized that Yahuweh was no longer talking to you like He was, how it saddened you and then depressed you and then drove you to think back and figure out what it was that broke the connection so that you could go to Him and repent and ask His forgiveness for breaking freindship with Him. He then does His part and forgives so the friendship can resume. That is the essence of beriyth-covenant.

I share your sentiments Jeannie. While I'm looking forward to seeing how YY covers this topic in the upcoming YY chapters, but I've truly enjoyed reading everyone's thoughts here. :<)

The Book of Enoch doesn't quote Adam or Chavvah (Eve) in this regard. It's a fascinating read, though some passages smell fishy (in a rabbinical sort of way). But Jude quotes from it, so it's worth a glance. Start here: http://www.heaven.net.nz/writings/enoch.htm

kp

I find it interesting that after the incident with the serpent; Yahweh came looking for Adam and Chavva, since an all knowing God would know where they were. But as always, when we fall, it is up to us to return to Yahweh, who is looking for us, he can not come to us unless we let him.