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Offline shohn  
#1 Posted : Thursday, September 13, 2007 6:59:16 AM(UTC)
shohn
Joined: 7/24/2007(UTC)
Posts: 160
Location: Texas

Okay, I've got more questions as usual. Is it possible that is part of the "secrets withheld"? What am I missing here?

In the Septuagint the Greek word, aion, is used to translate the
Hebrew word olam. Thus, if we want to get a sense of the New
Testament meaning of aion, we need to understand the meaning of
olam in the Old Testament. Numerous passages referring to olam
show clearly it cannot mean “never-ending.” Note these few:
♦ Jonah was in the fish forever [olam] until he left three days
later (Jon. 1:17; 2:6).
♦ Sodom’s fiery judgment is eternal [olam] until God returns
them to their former state (Ez. 16:53-55; Ju. 7).
♦ A Moabite is forbidden to enter the Lord’s congregation forever
[olam] until the 10th generation (De. 23:3).
♦ Hills are everlasting [olam] until made low…earth is burned
up (Ge. 49:26; De. 33:15; Is. 40:4; 2Pe. 3:10).
♦ Mountains are everlasting
[olam] until they are scattered
(Hab. 3:6).
♦ A slave serves his master forever
[olam] until death ends
his servitude (Ex. 21:6).
♦ The Mosaic covenant is everlasting
[olam] until it vanishes
away (Le. 24:8; He. 8:7-13).
♦ The Aaronic priesthood is everlasting [olam] until the likeness
of Melchizedek arises (Ex. 40:15; Nu. 25:13; He. 7:14-22).
♦ These “stones” are to be a memorial forever until (Jos. 4:7)?
Where are they now?
♦ The leprosy of Naaman shall cling forever [olam] until his
death, of course (2K. 5:27).
♦ God dwells in Solomon’s temple forever [olam] until it is destroyed
(2Ch. 7:16; 1K 8:13; 9:3).
♦ Animal sacrifices were to be offered forever [olam] until
ended by the work of Christ (2Ch. 2:4; He. 7:11-10:18).
♦ Circumcision was an everlasting [olam] covenant until the
new covenant (Ge. 17:9-13; 1Co. 7:19; Ga. 5:6).
♦ Israel’s judgment lasts forever [olam] until the Spirit is
poured out and God restores it (Is. 32:13-15).
♦ I will make you an eternal [olam] excellence until many generations
(Is. 60:15).

--
Shohn of Texas
Offline Jim  
#2 Posted : Monday, September 24, 2007 8:30:22 PM(UTC)
Jim
Joined: 6/28/2007(UTC)
Posts: 57
Man
Location: Central Florida

shohn,
I followed your reference from the other post concerning Revelation 21:8. I definitely was missing your point but in both cases I think it is an issue translation without context. Olam or Owlam is often translated in error. There is a whole website on just this word see http://www.owlam.com/ (don't get caught up in his AEF discussion because he never really draws a conclusion other than we can't determine the context because we weren't there when author wrote it.)

Look at the Old Testament Hebrew Lexicon for owlam:
KJV (439) - alway, 2; always, 3; ancient, 5; ever, 272; everlasting, 63; evermore, 15; long, 2; misc, 6; more, 2; never, 13; never + (0408), 2; old, 22; perpetual, 22; time, 6; world, 4;
NAS (299) - Everlasting, 2; ages, 1; all successive, 1; always, 1; ancient, 13; ancient times, 3; continual, 1; days of old, 1; eternal, 2; eternity, 3; ever, 10; everlasting, 110; forever, 70; forever and ever, 1; forevermore, 1; lasting, 1; long, 2; long ago, 3; long past, 1; long time, 3; never, 17; old, 11; permanent, 10; permanently, 1; perpetual, 29; perpetually, 1;

It would take to long to hit every reference or should I say it would take "owlam". I'm sorry, I couldn't resist that one. hehehe
Suffice it to say the context should define "forever" or "a really long time". Yahuweh never contradicts himself and is perfectly consistent.

Let me address a logic flaw in a statement you made.

Quote:
In the Septuagint the Greek word, aion, is used to translate the
Hebrew word olam. Thus, if we want to get a sense of the New
Testament meaning of aion, we need to understand the meaning of
olam in the Old Testament.


That just isn't true unless you are assuming that in all places you see aion in the Renewed Covenant the original text was Hebrew and used the word owlam.
Jim
Offline Ruchamah  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, September 25, 2007 6:51:02 AM(UTC)
Ruchamah
Joined: 8/7/2007(UTC)
Posts: 72
Location: TN

Hi,
I am not sure if this will help in this discussion at all, but etymologically, OLAM means: beyond the horizon. It is not a SPECIFIC term, just past the place that your eyes can see, ie, far away.

Ruch
If you are going to walk on thin ice, you might as well dance.
Offline Jim  
#4 Posted : Tuesday, September 25, 2007 2:45:52 PM(UTC)
Jim
Joined: 6/28/2007(UTC)
Posts: 57
Man
Location: Central Florida

Ruch,
I found that very helpful! What was your source for the entymology of the word?
Jim
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